China and Pakistan present new Iran deal: Ceasefire for opening Hormuz

Not spooked, realistic. There are very few people less trustworthy than this trump administration. Have they done a single honest thing for the good of anyone not them?

Tbh, American or not, believe anything that Trump and his goons said at this point is stupid.

He didn’t “spook” us, he just lies. Continuously. Daily. Proudly. So, um, no, whatever comes out of the WH is not credible for now.

I'd trust a dead dog more than the President of the USA at this juncture, and I'd be completely historically justified in that stance. Sure, nothing desirable or productive is going to emanate from the dead dog, but I know anything Trump vomits out is going to be a lie.

Yeah, if trump posts something on twitter and a north korean propaganda outlet would say the opposite, I would have real trouble deciding who to believe.

Magastan #1

Did he have any cards?

he only owns the one suit, all putin lets him wear

He isn't playing with a full deck

> Pakistan's hatred for Israel is well known. if Pakistan gets involved it will be on the side of Israel. The citizens are not going to look at this in any other way other than religious backstabbing. The government literally doesn’t recognise Israel. There is zero chance the Pakistani military or government would openly side with Israel. They will get involved on the side of is the US/Saudi, if they do. With that said, Pakistanis support Saudi. So most likely, the government will spin it as some Sunni/Shia issue and they’re supporting Saudi. > Pakistan basically sucks up to China and putting a proposal that would anyway harm China puts them in a bad spot for future dealings. Pakistan sucks up to both China and the US. It’s one of the reasons the Iran-Pakistan pipeline to bring over gas from Iran has stalled. They fear sanctions from the US, despite the fact that China would want it because it makes their access easier. They are sandwiched between both geopolitically. Currently they’re trying to use the Trump admin to boost their favours from the US (they nominated him for the Nobel prize last year lol). Pakistan will most assuredly ask for concessions from the US for helping to mediate this. Like any sanctions for the Iran-Pakistan pipeline being wavered or whatever else. Pakistan is also weary because, if Iran gets overthrown, they are probably next. They’re the only other “nonaligned” nation in the area. Except, they’re nuclear armed. The US already has stated that they’re the other main threat next to Russia, North Korea and Iran. If there’s a huge civil unrest due to Iran’s situation, and refugees/terrorists crossing the borders, it will most assuredly be a pretext for the US to “secure” Pakistan’s nuclear arsenal. There are several Pakistani Shia militant groups whose support will be affected by Iran’s collapse and they will probably be heading back.

You've been so brainwashed by your own media that you think the entire world revolves around conflict because this is how they justify the insane military spending. We live in a globalized world and EVERYONE, will be affected by what is happening, even oil producing countries, because we import and export a lot of materials. So yes, no one benefits from this, and even countries who arent aligned with the US interventionism, like China, Russia, NK, Iran, Brazil, etc. dont want the US economy to implode, why?, because of globalization, any harsh recession in the US will cause ripples to every other economy worldwide. Anyone with a brain can see the position in which Trump and Israel have put the US right now, either they back down and have to give concessions to Iran on almost everything and lose their presence in the region, or they continue and destroy the world by creating a massive crisis in the middle east, removing a huge portion not only of oil but also natural gas which is required in many different fields beyond just energy and most importantly, destroying their allies economies for no reason at all when they already had negotiated a favorable agreement with Iran, since no one in their right mind wants what is happening right now, only the insane people who, spoiler alert, are the aggressors in this instance. Why is China negotiating?, because thats how things should be done, with diplomacy and using economic ties as motivation, not conditioning submission and servitude with death and destruction.

They aren’t surrendering. The U.S. is considering leaving in defeat

No, it makes the *US* look weak. The USA wants to “might is right” its way rn. Its not that terrible, unless youre the regime that’s beating its chest trying to be top dog

Hilarious you think iran is going to surrender. This isn't victory for the US lmao

Damage is already done. US can’t negotiate anymore.

Israel is guaranteed to attack again if Iran manages to restore its nuclear program.

It's a W in the sense that Iran has shown that Israel and the U.S. just can't exert their will on the country. I really doubt the U.S. will be supporting ANY strikes on Iran again for a generation after this shit show. So, they gain a bit of legitamacy, albeit at a super high cost. In the end though, it may gurantee the survival of the regime for a long time, and it will prove to themselves that doubling down on Ballistic Missiles and Drones is the winning hand. They wont bother with a Navy and AF in the future, just more missiles and drones..

They are still slinging rockets and drones on a daily basis, "most" of their military infrastructure is untouched as it's hidden inside mountains. I know you're not serious though because you're talking about uranium enrichment which their leader(who was killed in the opening attacks) was fundamentally against nuclear weapons and the guy who took over is not. So if the US cared about nuclear enrichment they probably shouldn't have killed the one guy who prevented enrichment to hit weapon grade levels.