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Announcements Aug 10, 2016 at 5:01 PM

Click to hear about some of the things that have been keeping us busy. #2 will blow your mind.

Posted by spez

I would like to share some of the things we have been up to since we last chatted. On the product side, we’ve been busy. Both our [iPhone](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/listnook-the-official-app/id1064216828?mt=8) and [Android](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.listnook.frontpage&hl=en) apps have had [multiple releases](https://www.listnook.com/r/listnookmobile), and we’re proud at how well they are progressing. Mobile web (m.listnook.com) is undergoing a major overhaul that we’re testing internally, and hope to start showing to users in the next couple weeks. We have been running many experiments on desktop web to increase user engagement, particularly for users who are new to Listnook. You can see what experiments we are running on this [live thread](https://www.listnook.com/live/x3ckzbsj6myw/), and notable changes to the site are listed in r/changelog. We’ve started development on a new frontpage algorithm. The current algorithm is outdated and is no longer meeting our needs. There are a number of problems we’d like to solve: increased velocity, improved personalization, reduced dependence on /new, and not requiring us to choose the defaults. We’re still in the early days, but I’m happy we’re dedicating resources to it. As it relates to monetization, we’ve made a handful of changes: we [tested adding affiliate tags](https://www.listnook.com/r/announcements/comments/4mv578/affiliate_links_on_listnook/) to e-commerce links, which we ended up turning off; we announced [Promoted User Posts](https://www.listnook.com/r/announcements/comments/4upf11/new_ad_type_promoted_user_posts/); and we announced [tests we’ll be running](https://www.listnook.com/r/announcements/comments/4phzsi/sponsored_headline_tests_placement_and_design/) on sponsored headlines. Changes and additions to ads can be met with skepticism, and this is why we test changes carefully and listen to feedback. As we evolve our ads platform, we are working to do it in a way that that complements the core experience and engages listnookors. These changes and experiments will continue to happen, but while it is critical that we build Listnook into a sustainable business, we don’t want to compromise what’s brought us here. Going forward, we will list these in r/changelog so all these kinds of announcements are in one place. Yesterday, we previewed [new moderator mail](https://www.listnook.com/r/modnews/comments/4wwzzs/new_modmail_a_demo_and_a_call_for_beta_testers/) to moderators. This has been a long time coming, and we’re excited to show it off. The current moderator mail system is a hack on top of our messaging system, which is itself a hack on top of our commenting system. The new tool should save a lot of time for everyone, and new tech stack will allow for better future iterations and builds. We’ll be working with moderators to refine it while we work towards a full rollout. We’ve seen great results from our Anti-Evil, Trust & Safety, and Community teams. The mandate of these teams is to eliminate spam and abuse and to ensure Listnook is a welcoming place for all. In the last quarter, we’ve reduced harassment reports by 15%, spam reports by 66%, and moderator spam removals by 15%. We’ve also reduced our support ticket backlog substantially, dropping our average response time from 64 hours to 7 in the process. Happy to chat about this stuff, or anything else. e: grammar u: Thank you! Heading out for now. Will check back later.
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195 Comments

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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +1810
[removed]
1810
prophettoloss Aug 10, 2016 +70
How much do you think a Mod account is worth on r/Politics or r/Worldnews?
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Sil369 Aug 10, 2016 +88
Bidding for my account starts at 1 billion dollars.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +2360
We're aware of it, but can't comment at the moment.
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beet111 Aug 10, 2016 +172
> You may not license, transfer, sell, or assign Your Account **without our written approval.** have you ever approved of selling or transferring an account? just curious.
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rwbronco Aug 10, 2016 +39
Perhaps a celebrity that does an AMA and later wants to use that username as their own personal account since they enjoyed the site? Just a scenario that popped in my head
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +25
[deleted]
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frymaster Aug 10, 2016 +48
Obama did his AMA with an account that someone else had previously held
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chrunchy Aug 11, 2016 +9
>Are you going to do anything about the buying and selling of listnook accounts >We're aware of it, but can't comment at the moment. The gaming of Listnook is very important to me, and if I may speak for others I think generally people want "organically-sourced" listnook posts and news stories. I personally don't want to be spoon-fed propaganda or someone's spin on issues. I realize it's crazy-difficult for the admins to be able to sort these out sometimes... maybe consider addressing this in it's own post sometime?
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phamily_man Aug 10, 2016 +1552
Lol at people downvoting this. This comment most likely means there is pending legal action being taken against the site.
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Xaxxon Aug 10, 2016 +100
Either that or they're trying to build up a backlog of accounts to ban and don't want to share the heuristics they're using to catch people.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +86
Many game developers do the same thing. Rather than banning offenders as you find them, you observe them to learn how to automate detection. Then comes the ban wave and a million accounts are gone.
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Xaxxon Aug 10, 2016 +28
As soon as people know HOW they are being caught, they can change just that bit. All the work put into finding out how to catch them is gone as soon as that change is made. Yeah, it's likely exactly the same process here.
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ZadocPaet Aug 10, 2016 +94
> This comment most likely means there is pending legal action being taken against the site. Plus they're actively banning the f*** out of these accounts as they catch them. Most of them are pretty obvious to any mod who is reviewing submissions. They get reported/banned.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +388
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +46
deleted ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.7914 [^^^What ^^^is ^^^this?](https://pastebin.com/FcrFs94k/91699)
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javaski Aug 10, 2016 +373
Why are you guys downvoting him? This almost surely means it's a legal battle and commenting would jeopardize the case.
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oggusfoo Aug 10, 2016 +36
Do you all have the capability of seeing who is actually voting on comments? I thought it not a bad idea back when TD was given the warning about actually viewing the link, judging the quality of the comment, and then up voating if it were worthy. Have you considered "weighting" votes? The less someone votes then when they do vote on a link, it means more than someone up voting every link in the new queue. It would naturally weed out the paid or militant participants by reducing their impact on the front page significantly.
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Jakeable Aug 10, 2016 +1071
Could you guys fix how Google puts m.listnook.com links in desktop results? Not sure if it's something that can be fixed but it's annoying nonetheless.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +1242
Yes. The m.listnook.com domain will go away, and we'll use www.listnook.com for both, relying on browsers / user preferences to show the correct site.
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Kayehnanator Aug 10, 2016 +36
I've had a strange feature happen while browsing on my phone. I've had the main listnook.com desktop browser for the most part, but every week or two, the preference resets and it goes back to m.listnook.com. Then I have to reset my preferences, where it works for another week or two. Not really a big deal, but just kinda of annoying. Any clue?
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absentmindedjwc Aug 10, 2016 +304
Is there any plans on *actually remembering* preferences? I randomly get funneled (while logged in) to the mobile site regardless of how many times I tell it to show me the desktop site.
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Lt_LetDown Aug 10, 2016 +63
Drives me bonkers. In the last announcement, and I'm paraphrasing, it was said that users can choose the desktop site and it will remember your choice. Unfortunately, I get redirected to the mobile site and awful lot and it's very frustrating.
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powerlanguage Aug 17, 2016 +5
Hey - I am looking into this and I am trying to get feedback from people experiencing this issue. If you have a minute, it'd be super helpful if you could answer the following questions: * What type of phone do you have? * What browser are you using? * Are you browsing in incognito/private private browsing mode * Do you have javascript or cookies disabled on your mobile browser? * When you end up on the mobile website, how do attempt to navigate to the desktop website? * Have you tried [this method of opting out of the mobile site](https://i.redd.it/a7xmc3frn52x.gif) - Note, this is different from requesting the desktop site via your browser. Sorry again for this issue, any feedback you can provide will help us figure this out. Thanks.
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powerlanguage Aug 17, 2016 +4
Hey - I am looking into this and I am trying to get feedback from people experiencing this issue. If you have a minute, it'd be super helpful if you could answer the following questions: * What type of phone do you have? * What browser are you using? * Are you browsing in incognito/private private browsing mode * Do you have javascript or cookies disabled on your mobile browser? * When you end up on the mobile website, how do attempt to navigate to the desktop website? * Have you tried [this method of opting out of the mobile site](https://i.redd.it/a7xmc3frn52x.gif) - Note, this is different from requesting the desktop site via your browser. Sorry again for this issue, any feedback you can provide will help us figure this out. Thanks.
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factoid_ Aug 11, 2016 +9
Yes please. I hate the mobile site. Actually I hate basically all mobile sites. Every decent mobile device since the first iPhone has been built to display normal desktop sites. Mobile specific sites are a relic of the early 2000s. Just make your site have adaptive features that handles portrait mode gracefully and call it a day.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +55
[deleted]
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h_p_bitchcraft Aug 10, 2016 +9
Glad someone else thinks so. Up until three weeks ago, my phone ALWAYS showed the desktop site, but now the only way I can view it is by changing my settings to desktop view. Mobile listnook is a pile of useless ass and I really hate being forced to use it. Holy f*** I'm angry now.
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F54280 Aug 10, 2016 +7
And for a couple of weeks recently, the f****** menu didn't work on an iPhone when you were logged in, forcing me to use the god-f******-awful mobile f******-junk UI, or browsing logged out. Kill the mobile version with fire. Nothing is literally better than that shit. F***, you made me angry. What a piece of c***.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +138
deleted ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.5472 [^^^What ^^^is ^^^this?](https://pastebin.com/FcrFs94k/37129)
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SupDos Aug 10, 2016 +12
oh my god, every time i wanted to use compact i thought you had to put .compact at the end of the url, and now I learn that you can put an i??
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +26
deleted ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.6944 [^^^What ^^^is ^^^this?](https://pastebin.com/FcrFs94k/97902)
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +83
[deleted]
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solemn_fable Aug 10, 2016 +200
I'm actually enjoying the official listnook app for iOS. Took a while, but it's growing on me. My biggest criticism: can we have an option to make the buttons on comments bigger or easier to tap? Usually it's simple. [Click on comment, vote buttons appear, pick my vote.] But then there's the comments with only one or two words. Or pun threads. [Click on comment. Somehow missed and collapsed comments below it. Tap to uncollapse. Oops, tapped on commenter's username. Back out of user page. Try again til it works].
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +249
> My biggest criticism: can we have an option to make the buttons on comments bigger or easier to tap? Yes, this gets me too.
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r1singphoenix Aug 10, 2016 +76
To piggyback onto this, there are a couple of features from Alien Blue that I think, if implemented, could really improve the user experience: 1. While I love that the ability to go "back" by swiping from the left side of the screen was carried over from AB, I really miss being able to swipe from the right side of the screen in order to return to whatever I just came back from after using the "back" swipe. Not only would it be an excellent QOL improvement, but it is, in my opinion, a very natural-feeling feature to use. 2. The ability to swipe left on the body of any comment and collapse the entire thread containing the comment. While I don't think the little "move down to the next comment thread" button is a bad solution, I feel that collapsing threads is a better solution, due to the ease of returning to a comment thread far above the thread currently being viewed, but still far enough from the top of the comments to make returning to the top of the page and scrolling down an inconvenience. I am aware that it is still possible to collapse threads using an individual comment's "drop down" menu, however this can be rather awkward with one-handed browsing. Anyway, besides these two things, I am really enjoying the official app. Keep it up!
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812many Aug 10, 2016 +10
The ease of the collapse feature on the original Alien Blue is one of the main reasons I haven't moved over yet. Thanks for bringing this one up!
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +11
Also when a comment lines up with the bottom of the page, you can't click the rightmost button because of the "next comment" button... annoying as well
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poop-trap Aug 10, 2016 +642
What does "increased velocity" for the front-page algorithm mean?
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +1731
It means more turnover. Check Listnook in the morning, couple hours later, check it again: fresh content.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +44
[deleted]
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geoff_ Aug 10, 2016 +1808
This sounds good, but I hope this doesn't mean that major posts (whether that be a very high-profile AMA or major news story) will get pushed further down quicker. I don't want to miss out on major posts just because I didn't check listnook every 2 hours.
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__PETTYOFFICER117__ Aug 10, 2016 +217
I'd hope that it'd account for when you last checked/how often you typically check. As in: - If you checked Listnook two hours ago and saw the post about [major news story], when you check two hours later, new content. or - If you check Listnook maybe once or twice a day, [major news story] or [new star-wars trailer] stays there all day for you.
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iamPause Aug 10, 2016 +44
That's the problem. How do you systematically get fresh content to the front page faster, retain "major" posts longer, yet do it in a way that is equitably so people don't scream "censorship" or "bias"? If you can answer that, then [here you go](https://about.listnook.com/careers/).
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GasStationSushi Aug 10, 2016 +222
> This sounds good, but I hope this doesn't mean that major posts (whether that be a very high-profile AMA or major news story) will get pushed further down quicker. Likely easily solved by sorting by "Top" for today, rather than "Hot".
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Lippuringo Aug 10, 2016 +217
That's an additional click. No deal, too risky.
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420AllHailCthulhu420 Aug 10, 2016 +13
But then you'll not get it if something huge happened in a small sublistnook, because all the default's posts of this day will be higher, even if the huge news in the small sublistnook break their all time highest post
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brickmack Aug 10, 2016 +132
On the AMA side, they might as well push them down quicker. Posters there always stop replying like 20 minutes in. What the f*** is the point of even having an AMA if the people leave before you finish typing your damn question?
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ExploreAndTell Aug 10, 2016 +47
Most people, who people want to see AMAs from, are very busy people. They can't dedicate 2 or 3 hours to browsing listnook!
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squidonthebass Aug 10, 2016 +7
Shoutout to Adam Henrique who did back-to-back AMA's on /r/hockey and /r/devils and stayed on late into the night...and then came back the next day to answer even more questions.
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andersonimes Aug 10, 2016 +9
He mentioned their algorithm would be personalized. This could mean that a revisit would trigger new content to be shown without necessarily sinking the original content to the bottom for everyone. Facebook's feed works exactly this way and it essentially makes Facebook even more of a Skinner Box for people. Bringing this to Listnook would be great.
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InternetWeakGuy Aug 10, 2016 +75
Does this take into account how often the user visits? Will someone who visits once a day see the best of the day whereas someone who visits five times a day see a rolling best of? I DON'T WANT TO MISS THE BEST BITS!!!
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poop-trap Aug 10, 2016 +684
Lovely, as that's what I do all day.
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redikulous Aug 10, 2016 +54
Like it used to be a few years ago. Finally you guys have heard our complaints about stagnation on the frontpage!
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floralcode Aug 10, 2016 +388
Can you guys add an adult tag so I don't get drowned in p*** when I go to r/all? A way to filter out all the p*** would make r/all actually usable.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +565
Yes. r/all is literally NSFW for me now. We need to make a distinction between NSFW, p***, and spoilers.
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DFGdanger Aug 10, 2016 +25
I have the NSFW filter enabled in my user preferences so I never see any of that, but sometimes I will want to check out a random NSFW post or sublistnook and it asks me to enable the preference. What I would like is for it to give me a warning like it does but then let me view the post or sub and then turn the filter back on automatically...rather than me having to dig back into the preferences to turn it back on.
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brickmack Aug 10, 2016 +155
Oh, finally support for spoilers. Its always awkward browsing some sublistnook that uses NSFW tags for that, and then the one day you decide to listnook at your grandmas house someone decides to post a massive album of very explicit and kinda fucked up rule 34
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TheRealGC13 Aug 10, 2016 +13
A special request from a sub that uses spoilers heavily: during the transition, can there please be a one-time way for a sub's mods to turn all of their NSFW posts into spoilered posts? It would make going through the archives make a lot more sense. But yeah, official spoiler support? Fantastic news!
13
Super_Cyan Aug 10, 2016 +367
Can we also filter out anything that's *not* p***? I'm just here to fap.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +25
[deleted] ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.9980 > [What is this?](https://pastebin.com/64GuVi2F/93561)
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zang227 Aug 10, 2016 +16
/u/Super_Cyan asking the real questions. But for now you can just use multilistnooks :)
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +113
> distinction between NSFW [and] p*** Guess we know what /u/spez does at work ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +50
[deleted]
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +66
> Does this include what we use automoderator to remove daily? No, we're counting actual moderator actions presently. The two are probably correlated, but I don't know off the top of my head. The ultimate goal is to save moderator time.
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almightybob1 Aug 10, 2016 +1779
Please for the love of f*** stop defaulting back to the mobile version every time even though I click "show me the desktop version" EVERY. F******. TIME.
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pm_me_your_sundress Aug 10, 2016 +18
I really hate the mobile version. Desktop is way better, even on mobile devises. Hope he listens.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +1083
Second time I've heard this today. We will investigate.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +152
To piggyback on this, I still prefer and use i.listnook.com for mobile browsing, and it's frustrating as hell when I click an internal listnook link, and it transfers over to m.listnook.com. When you made your push for "m", it was promised that "i" wouldn't be changed, but this change did happen, and it is somewhat vexing. I know that eventually you will likely stop supporting "i", but until then, can you leave it along for those of us who prefer its minimalist design, and stop trying to push us to the new format? The new "m" just feels too much like buzzfeed, or a similar clickbait page for my tastes, and is less intuitive.
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Creampo0f Aug 10, 2016 +34
Am I the only person using https://www.listnook.com/.compact ? What's the difference? I learned to add .compact to the URL a long time ago and just kept using that. For years. Edit: I guess it's the same thing, just a different URL. All this time I've been adding ".compact" when I could have just added an "i"
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +33
i.listnook.com IS listnook.com/.compact just faster to type in than the .compact
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GMMan_BZFlag Aug 10, 2016 +6
When I used to use .compact, all of the links from the .compact interface would go to the proper page, but any internal links in user comments and link submissions would go to the regular desktop site, since those aren't rewritten. If you're talking about the latter type of links, what's most likely happening is you're going to the desktop site, and it's detecting that you're on mobile, so it redirects you to m. It would be nice if the site could check referrer to see if you were using i. or .compact, and adjust accordingly.
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EmperorNortonThe2nd Aug 10, 2016 +8
I absolutely agree with this request. I didn't agree until I went to i. and was invited to test out m. i.listnook.com is much more efficient at browsing content. If m.listnook.com is to replace i.listnook.com, please push the format of m. in the direction of i.
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kenfury Aug 10, 2016 +19
Same here. I dont need pictures or a fancy UI. All I want to see is the article with a link, and the 30 or so comments.
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althius1 Aug 10, 2016 +59
Seriously, this drives me NUTS. A simple "Don't ask me again" is all I want. Pretty please. That banner takes up, like, 10% of my screen... every. single. time. I. open. listnook. I know you guys love your mobile app, but I don't. I want my "desktop" experience. Pleaseandthankyou.
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bezelbum Aug 10, 2016 +11
Yup drives me nuts too. I might be an edge-case, but I preferred "desktop" listnook on my phone. The new "m" sucks balls, and I've found if I come back to a tab I left open I just get the loading gif if I try and expand any comments.
11
Zagorath Aug 10, 2016 +170
Is there a chance of having at least some sublistnook CSS work on mobile, too? I've noticed, for example, that TV based subs that use CSS for spoilers don't work on mobile. Maybe a Listnook-wide implementation of spoiler syntax would work?
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Thorbinator Aug 10, 2016 +95
We've been asking for spoiler tags since forever. Don't hold your breath but it would be nice.
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thisguyisULTRAdumb Aug 10, 2016 +74
why even bother with a mobile version, it's utter shit compared to "show desktop version" on **every single phone** i've ever used it on.
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poweroflegend Aug 10, 2016 +8
Also, it would be a good idea to add device detection to the mobile page as well. If I visit a regular listnook link from my phone, it detects that I'm on mobile and returns the mobile page (which is great - I like the mobile layout). However, if I click a mobile formatted link from the desktop, there's no detection and I still end up on the mobile page, which is really wonky on a monitor. It would be really nice to be sent to the desktop page instead. So many people post links from mobile that I run into this all the time, especially when browsing subs that link to other subs like /r/bestof, /r/worstof, /r/bestoflegaladvice, etc.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +5
[removed]
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VitruvianMonkey Aug 10, 2016 +32
No. Please make the mobile version the opt in one. I don't have a full web browser on my phone to look at a glorified app. Edit for clarity: I HAVE a full web browser, therefore I would prefer to see full websites.
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LogicWavelength Aug 10, 2016 +63
hey /u/Spez! I'm a mod for /r/Watches, and a decent chunk of our mod team uses listnook on mobile, specifically iPhones. What is the time table for moderator tools (even just a measly remove/approve function!) coming to the mobile app? It would be *phenomenal* to get other things, such as a separate button for mod mail, but I imagine that is not coming any time soon.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +66
The new mod mail should work well on mobile. The rest of the tools will follow.
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bitparity Aug 10, 2016 +161
Purely out of curiosity, is there in any sort of works the possibility of changing the sublistnook moderator system from the strict seniority that it is, to some kind of democratic form? The most common complaint for many users and mods about Listnook is the arbitrary nature of leadership for many forums, sometimes to great detriment.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +152
It's very much on our minds, but if there was a simple solution, we'd have done it by now.
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cfuse Aug 11, 2016 +7
Users already have a vote: they can unsub. I don't agree with screwing over mods that did all the work of building a sub and then having the usual suspects swoop in for a hostile takeover. I also have little confidence in listnook's management to be impartial in complaints about sub theft. Don't change the sub leadership, change the transparency. Public rolling moderation logs. If people are claiming something is fishy then they can prove it and the community can make their own decisions *democratically* by choosing what to subscribe to. There also needs to be a free for all forum of some sort for people to talk about a sub without that sub's moderators being able to prevent that. That can be short term and rolling too. More like chat or the breaking news format than a standard post. There's nothing wrong with mods not being elected, just with the ability for subscribers to be aware of what's going on with mods and subs.
7
[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +102
I'm sure the solution isn't simple. Imagine what would happen if /r/The_Donald took over /r/AskHistorians. We know there is a sizable mass of user accounts that are extremely bored and active. If you ever let the users vote out mods, this mass will take over listnook one sublistnook at a time.
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LogicWavelength Aug 11, 2016 +8
I took this to mean: democracy among mods, not democracy of the user base holding mods accountable. For example, some account sitting at the top of /r/Seiko didn't show up for years, except to make some comment somewhere just before the time cutoff for them to have him removed by Listnook admins, ensuring his dominance of the sublistnook forever. The rest of the mod team ran the sub very nicely, amassing a great, tiny sub. Then out of the blue that guy shows back up boots out the rest of the mods and the sub went down the drain. The booted mods attempted to create a new sublistnook and get people to migrate, but it's just too difficult and the whole thing died pretty much. If those mods could have voted out their "leader" there wouldn't be a problem.
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Tacomaverick Aug 10, 2016 +160
Any extra details/suspicions on the algorithm changes? Less dependence on the new tab seems interesting but I have no clue how it would be done.
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +275
To get rid of the new page, we can show new links on a few people's frontpage to see if they're any good. Everyone will be drafted into the Knights of New.
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javaski Aug 10, 2016 +174
Is there a specific reason to remove the "new" page entirely? Couldn't you implement that change while also leaving "new" in place?
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +16
>Is there a specific reason to remove the "new" page entirely? Couldn't you implement that change while also leaving "new" in place I would actually support it being a sublistnook option to disable it, or just disable it. Gaming listnook starts on /new/ and even a small group of dedicated people can reshape a sublistnook quickly with targeted and intentional /new/ action. Political actors, advertisers, brigaders, etc. The same stuff in the top comment in the AMA with selling accounts. The dirty side of being a popular site. Disabling access and basically A/B testing all links against large userbase would radically alter how easy listnook is to game by small groups and would nullify one of the most potent brigade targets. I think it would make front pages and the top 100 links have a lot more integrity as being legitimately upvoted by the the communities 10% of engagers.
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lytedev Aug 10, 2016 +27
The OP only mentions reducing dependency on the "new" page, not removing it. Wouldn't make much sense to do that!
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zworkaccount Aug 10, 2016 +65
This is an interesting idea, but it would undoubtedly lead to a lot more people seeing spam and off topic posts than currently do though, no?
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +31
[deleted]
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know_comment Aug 10, 2016 +4
I wouldn't mind seeing sponsored content and unvetted content peppered into my frontpage if it was done at the right ratio and the algorithm moved content faster. Listnook's spam system is pretty good, the problem with /r/new is mainly that the vast majority of content is terrible. BUT, hopefully top stories and posts will stick around long enough to catch without having to check in every three hours.
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Wild_Marker Aug 10, 2016 +17
Oh god the spoilers, so many more people would get spoilers.
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oggusfoo Aug 10, 2016 +20
You have to have a degree of curation. I'm sure you're aware how many articles are posted a minute. Trying to phase out "default" subs and putting all of new on everyone's front page will be your Digg 2.0, the company sponsored comments is 3.0. There's an entire community dedicated to "viral" marketing that's obviously not organic (hail corporate). Will the sponsors of the comment at least be public?
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +116
I also want to mention that I have been talking with some friends who are new to listnook, they LOVE the mobile web interface. I'm old and salty, but it does seem to be a good design direction
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +80
Thank you! The team will be happy to hear this.
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Anjin Aug 10, 2016 +40
The typography is looking a lot better with new releases, but I really think that you should push the mobile app team to take some cues from the old Alien Blue post layout. It was far easier to read when scanning through posts, and the functional content like vote counts and sublistnook just seemed better laid out. Now the non-title content is scattered all around the title where before it felt more contained to the right and bottom: http://i.imgur.com/tVldA3v.jpg
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NSA-SURVEILLANCE Aug 10, 2016 +201
Is this a secret way to say BuzzFeed is working with Listnook now?
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +435
I think one could say they've been working with us a long time.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +248
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SlothBabby Aug 10, 2016 +19
The Chive does the same thing. Their entire site is pretty much just galleries of pictures posted here or videos that got upvoted here.
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piguy123 Aug 10, 2016 +206
> because they steal all of our content
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +478
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +347
In some places, yes. In others, it's shiny and new. We're making steady progress cleaning things up.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +362
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GetTheLedPaintOut Aug 10, 2016 +116
Let's just be honest, coder-to-coder: *we're* hacks all the way down. Some are just newer hacks than others.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +4
I always manage to convince my teams we need to rewrite an app completely every year or 2 if there are changes that have been / will be made that weren't in the original scope and require changes in the way other systems work to add them. They hate me for it but my code is cleaner and it really doesn't take long to redo and do it better after you've done it once.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +310
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +683
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +38
Same here... I love Alien Blue on iPhone, but it is not supported anymore :( The official Listnook App does not "feel" like listnook, I like my UI simple and my images only loaded on request...
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +854
Yes, we will continue to allow third party apps.
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rawky Aug 10, 2016 +162
I know your weight is behind your listnook app and my hopes for continuing support for AlienBlue are lost. That said, is there any chance you can implement some of the good features from AB (e.g. gallery view, long press preview etc.). AB was really an excellent app, new Listnook feels like a backstep in my opinon I'm afraid
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titosrevenge Aug 11, 2016 +8
All I want is the swipe gesture that collapses threads. It's painful having to scroll through so much drivel once I'm tired of the thread. I know you can click the arrow at the top of the thread to collapse it, but then I have to scroll up to do it. Please just open source Alien Blue so that the community can continue developing it.
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captainjon Aug 10, 2016 +52
Don't mean to hijack this /u/spez but I still have Alien Blue as I prefer it over the native app. I haven't deleted it so I can still get updates but what I don't like is if I google something and it takes me to listnook I do NOT want it going to the listnook app. Or any app. Rather read it in Safari and be done. I get iOS does that by pressing the top right but I don't want another app to open if I don't need it too.
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Neghtasro Aug 11, 2016 +22
This is more of an iOS issue than a listnook/AB one. Apple doesn't really give users a way to determine which links open in which apps the same way Android does (at least that I've found, someone please let me know if I'm wrong).
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +54
Hi spez, question about defaults. I know I am a super evil default mod that wants my status more than anything... But I am really happy that listnook is working on onboarding instead of the default system. --- My question with onboarding is, do you think there will still be at least some kind of "default set"? Is it going to be more like Twitter where we HAVE to make it our own? Or do we not know yet? Guess my question is, where do we stand when it comes to Listnook onboarding? What can we expect? Or is it too early to expect anything?
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +69
A lot of this is still in the air, but the general idea is somewhere in between the current frontpage, which is set by us, and r/all, which is pretty much everything. Onboarding is a separate development effort, but will play a big role in this. We will likely have improved onboarding before we have a new frontpage.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +28
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Advacar Aug 10, 2016 +8
The admins have always shown respect for sublistnook's wishes in cases like this. See /r/nfl and /r/askhistorians, who have been asked repeatedly to be on the front page and always replied no.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +230
What the hell is an Anti-Evil team?
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +310
It's the engineering team that focuses spam, abuse, and cheating.
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sean151 Aug 10, 2016 +268
Will it do anything about the bots that are used for the purpose of astroturfing on listnook?
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lIlIlIIlIIIlIIIIIl Aug 10, 2016 +89
Hey /u/spez! - I was wondering if I could ask what improvements are being made towards m.listnook.com? Wonderful work by the way. - Have a wonderful day!
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +106
The new version is a lot faster and quicker to develop on. It's our new web stack. New mod mail is built on this stack as well.
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OcelotWolf Aug 10, 2016 +30
Will I still be able to use desktop on mobile? I haven't liked a single design of m.listnook.com yet.
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mobuco Aug 10, 2016 +9
Yeah, there needs to be an opt-out of mobile option. I'm constantly having to go to "request desktop site" now and it sucks.
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OcelotWolf Aug 10, 2016 +9
And the fact that Google links always use the mobile site so if I Google something and return to Listnook, I gotta request desktop again
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Georgy_K_Zhukov Aug 10, 2016 +3589
/u/spez, Yesterday /r/AskHistorians was approached about being part of the A/B testing for this new 'sublistnook suggestion' system you are planning for mobile and told that it "*might drive some new traffic to your sublistnook*." We also were told to "*let us know if you have any questions, or see any problems*." Well, to be frank, we *do* have questions, and we *do* see problems, but when we responded stressing /r/AskHistorians' well-known opposition to default status and asking for more information about what this new system looked like we were told, "*I'm trying to get the right answers for you, but haven't tracked anyone down yet. However, I do know that this is a topic that u/spez will be covering in his AMA in r/announcements tomorrow morning, at least in regards to the way defaults work currently and what we're looking at for the future*." Unfortunately, this answer leaves us without any further information. So /u/spez, could you please provide us with more information about what inclusion in the A/B test entails, what the long term plan is, and whether sublistnooks will be able to opt out, or otherwise control how they are included. Regards, Zhukov and the AH Mod Team
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Stone_tigris Aug 10, 2016 +1233
It frustrates me that you've had to ask this in an announcements thread in a last-ditch attempt to get noticed. Time and time again we're told the admins are going to improve communication with moderators and, although I've heard less complaints recently, this still seems to me like yet another example of a lack of response. At least this time you've been told about a future change, it's just a shame you've been given no actual information on the change. EDIT: Great to see /u/spez's non-answer reinforcing this /s
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henry_fords_ghost Aug 10, 2016 +180
To their credit, the admin team have contacted us on previous occasions to alert us of and solicit feedback on proposed changes that could affect traffic, and on those occasions they were able to respond substantively to our questions and concerns. Hopefully we will get some information on this issue soon.
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bacon_flavored Aug 10, 2016 +36
Hi /u/spez I have a question regarding your self-serve and managed advertising platforms. Will you be expanding their capabilities in the near future (adding customizable and exportable reports for instance) or easier creative and campaign management tools? If we had the ability to fund a "bucket" that we could spend from for campaigns that would be a ton of help also when it comes to split testing things like landers and creatives without having to "lock in" a charge per-campaign. Thank you in advance for your time. Edit: thinks to things
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Handicapreader Aug 10, 2016 +250
If you can let me only use the desktop version of listnook on my iPhone, that would be great.
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starfishjenga Aug 10, 2016 +812
Something something clickbait headlines...
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +907
Maybe if you had better titles you wouldn't get downvoted to oblivion on all your posts. Or maybe it's because you are relentlessly trying to turn Listnook into Digg.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +158
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Hollins Aug 10, 2016 +39
Wait, so now we're doing *all* Buzzfeed's work for them?
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OcelotWolf Aug 10, 2016 +41
is only site, y u haff to be med
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Werner__Herzog Aug 10, 2016 +24
Now we know why spez wanted to bring back self post karma.
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KeythKatz Aug 10, 2016 +200
I also can't remember the last time Listnook 503'ed on me. Yay!
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umbrae Aug 10, 2016 +170
TBH this is the result of a ton of effort on our infra team, which we have two open roles for ([Sr Infra Eng](https://boards.greenhouse.io/listnook/jobs/231377) and [SRE](https://boards.greenhouse.io/listnook/jobs/251080)) and a [bunch of other things](https://boards.greenhouse.io/listnook). At our scale we have technical challenges that most sites on the internet don't even have to care about, which is exciting and terrifying. You too can reduce 503s!
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +39
[deleted]
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alittle_extreme Aug 10, 2016 +252
What is this #2 thing?
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Porsche924 Aug 10, 2016 +439
Regarding sponsored postings. Since they won't be able to downvote off the page, it would be nice if we could see the current vote count on them anyway, when they go into negative numbers. It shows the community that while we still need to be shown ads, we don't have to like their content, it would also show products that don't fit, they don't have to keep wasting their money on advertising that the audience wouldn't embrace.
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infectuz Aug 10, 2016 +160
This would never fly with the ad-buyers. However I don't know why listnook took away the up/downvote numbers from user submitted posts and comments. That was the best feature to address controversies, since a post that has heavy downvotes could have a lot of upvotes too but that data is not shown.
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nowandlater Aug 10, 2016 +45
Please tell me you don't take all the hate you get personally.
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silentz0r Aug 10, 2016 +8
Apart from the front page algorithm, how about updating the really really outdated UI? Maybe even simplifying it (to make it look neater) and moving a lot of actions to a separate panel?
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spez Aug 10, 2016 +49
All in due time. The majority of our traffic is mobile (and growing), and we don't have any product baggage there, so that's where our attention is. Updating desktop requires a transition plan for CSS, RES, and lots of user habits. I am chomping at the bit, though.
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alientity Aug 10, 2016 +64
PLEASE don't change it. I'm not a fan of the new whitespace-gasms many sublistnooks rely on now. The default is perfect.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +13
Devil's advocate here. Generally, for newcomers, listnook on desktop is pretty intimidating. How many people have you tried to get into listnook, take one look and immediately get confused and turn back? I know I could think of a dozen. Newcomers just don't know where to start with the current style. And with the default sublistnook list being subjective, a whole other load of potential users just get turned off. For a business point of view, this is very bad. You want to encourage growth on your site, not alientate potential users. I believe this one of the many reasons listnook on mobile has grown so much. The current site is great from a functionality point of view, but for many, a style update to make the site more approachable is definitely due. Web design has matured a lot these last few years and listnook on desktop really just hasn't kept up. Ideally, you'd want to update the style, whilst retaining all functionality. Something easier said than done. (I'd also like to see custom sublistnook styles standardisation guidelines so I can get back to the damn homepage when I click the logo like every other site ever, but that's a whole other thing).
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alientity Aug 10, 2016 +4
Well either way, they will be alienating one side, but they managed to grow really well so far. I would be ok with the default style 'updated' for logged out users, but still allowing registered users to stick with the existing default design (and always make sure that any changes are compatible) is a must. It's just more efficient, and more bandwidth/CPU/GPU friendly. I do agree mobile is important, and I'm sure listnook is aware of this, since they have been working hard on their mobile app.
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mesmerone Aug 10, 2016 +22
PLEASE DON'T. And kick anyone in the spine if they suggest lowering the information density.
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stormelemental13 Aug 10, 2016 +16
NOOO!!! Keep your filthy modern aesthetics away from my desktop!
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iplayguitarbackwards Aug 10, 2016 +111
Are you guys working on a better way to censor people we disagree with?
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +20
[deleted]
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akcom Aug 10, 2016 +25
> I don't want to be that guy Be honest, you love being that guy.
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JamesGandalfFeeney Aug 10, 2016 +206
Can you give the people a guarantee that listnook's front page algorithm won't be manipulated for political reasons the way Twitter's trending hashtags sometimes is?
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +38
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +24
deleted ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.3523 [^^^What ^^^is ^^^this?](https://pastebin.com/FcrFs94k/74219)
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Wargazm Aug 10, 2016 +8
> But if it instead means "Can you guarantee Listnook itself won't manipulate the front page to further the company's political goals" then the CEO should absolutely be able to explain the company's stance on that. It's still a trap. Listnook (the company) manipulates the whole site. They decide *everything*. If he gives a guarantee that he'll keep the company's politics out of algorithm decisions, then the second a pro-anything (or anti-anything) article disappears he's on the hook. And if he doesn't give the guarantee, then he'll be on the hook for *that*. Plus there's the problem of deciding what is political or not. Is banning racism political or is it moral? Is banning ads espousing psuedoscience political or is it a public service? Is the idea of banning itself political? F*** all of that. I wouldn't be giving out "guarantees" either. They already put up with more than enough shit without having to word a guarantee that will just be used against you in the future regardless of intent.
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anon_smithsonian Aug 10, 2016 +69
From what I understand, listnook lost its primary API developer about a year ago... and, since then, it seems like all API improvements and work has been very minimal. I understand that you guys are shifting priority to your own mobile app and mobile site, but can you please look into making sure that the API isn't let to go stale? For example, with the new modmail system that's coming down the road, please, ***please*** give us new modmail endpoints to reflect these new capabilities. Not only is this important to third-party app developers, but it's also really important to all of those running listnook bots and apps to aid with sublistnook moderation and operation. Additionally, the new mobile sublistnook appearance and styling stuff (which the *official listnook app uses*, mind you), like mobile color and mobile banner/icon, still isn't accessible via the API. It would also be great if third-parties could also use the wonderful new `i.redd.it` image uploading/hosting server, so we can ***all*** move away from the rapidly declining experience of using Imgur on a mobile device. So, I beg of you: ***please*** don't just put the API into maintain-but-don't-improve-upon mode.
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Booty_Bumping Aug 10, 2016 +131
/u/spez >improved personalization Please make this opt-out. Listnook is one of the few mainstream sites that still has the ability to show the exact same content to everyone. I understand voting systems aren't the best way to rank content, but you're making a terrible mistake by replacing it with personalization. I really hope that you guys will make the effort to improve the ranking algorithms so that conflicting world views aren't drowned out. You guys have all the data in the world to determine my personal opinions and could block out things I disagree with a flick of a switch, but this is just not the right thing to do. Personalization could be used to expand people's views of the world, not shrink it like facebook does. What would be great is if the data used for personalization was viewable and controllable by users. I'm sure many users will be okay with personalization as long as you can view the data and disable tracking for certain sublistnooks or domain names. Also, something really needs to be done about "shills". I probably wouldn't have used that word a few years ago, but now there are literally shills on listnook. Major sublistnooks are turning into propaganda for American political parties. They're buying and selling accounts and engaging in vote manipulation. You can't trust listnook as a news source when this kind of behavior is allowed. Oh, and please make it possible to disable `out.listnook.com` tracking when you're logged out. I have that domain blocked via `/etc/hosts` and it's incredibly annoying not being able to use listnook logged out. **Edit**: A lot of people have voiced their concerns about this. An admin response would be appreciated.
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FkIForgotMyPassword Aug 10, 2016 +7
> Please make this opt-out. Please yes. If there could be no personnalisation at all, it'd be even better, but realistically personnalisation is going to happen. I'd really like to be given the option to opt out. I doubt it'd be costly to implement (since it'd just have to treat me as if it didn't have any data about me, in terms of what content I'm viewing), I doubt it'd be costly to run (because most people wouldn't turn it off), and I really don't want to have to figure out a weird hack to get it to work. I've noticed a couple times, very occasionally, a post with 50 upvotes from a small sublistnook that I had just visited, on my /r/all, in one of the top 10 pages or something, and that's just creepy. I have options to create multi-listnooks or whatever they're called, or to subscribe to sublistnooks I'm interested in, and I can use RES to filter out sublistnooks I don't want to see: if I want to personnalise what I see I'll do it, I want to be able to see what others see. I want that if I'm a die-hard supporter of candidate X, but candidate Y's sublistnook has a very big post on /r/all, it's not hidden from me just because that doesn't fit my profile. I'd rather see my opinions challenged every once in a while, and my tastes tested, and my horizons opened, than see the Internet go from the kinda of media that shows you anything and everything to a set of independent, compartmentalized stupid echo chambers.
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thephotoman Aug 10, 2016 +14
I would hope that there's a way to see a "This is what a non-account user sees" thing built in. I hope that "improved personalization" is more akin to being able to select not to see domains in *your* view (like RES does already) or the ability to just completely ignore certain users. Again, these are things where a button can take you to default views.
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JX3 Aug 10, 2016 +6
Facebook's success with personalization and Twitter's meagre growth without it are pretty powerful incentives to adopt the approach. I don't disagree with the principles you laid out. Keeping the platform open is a very noble goal, but I think it seems less likely by the day. It requires dedication. Listnook has tons of user's who flag for open conversation, but who by their actions display completely opposite goals. Conversations often morph into scar exchange programs which in turn give people more incentive to support more moderation intervention. Being challenged takes a toll. Many people become exhausted of conflict and don't mind seeing it being shoved under the rug just to get a break. In principle many listnook users would probably oppose personalization. In practice, however, many wouldn't dislike it. Most of the content you consume in listnook is already pretty personalized. With a tad bit more you could get rid of the few threads you face in a day which cause you some level of anguish by disagreeing with you on something you care about.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +86
Good morning. 2 days ago, I posted [this](https://www.listnook.com/r/defaultmods/comments/4wptkh/a_coversation_on_the_topic_of_suspending_users/) about a user who doxxed someone who submitted to /r/tifu. They were suspended but came back about a half hour later. Can listnook **PLEASE** make doxxing a one and done offense? I've been doxxed and it was one of the worst things I've ever been through. Thank you for any help you can provide on this topic.
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AchievementUnlockd Aug 10, 2016 +37
Hi u/johnsmcjohn; I've been looking at this, and I'll share my thinking (hopefully later today) back on the original post. It might be tomorrow, though, given that my calendar is currently slammed through 8PM. :)
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ELI5_MODS_SUCK_ASS Aug 10, 2016 +11
Could we please not have blatant scam/rip off websites as ads on the mobile website? They're all the same type of scheme and market and I'm sure it's the same 'business' at the top, but they're everywhere. Advertisements that say pretty verbatim "Hey listnook! I just opened by new dog collar/watch/sunglasses business and am looking for some people to get the word out! If you type in "LISTNOOK WATCH" in the checkout you'll get my $56 watch for free! All I need you guys to do is pay the shipping on it!". And it links to what seems like a real website for some nice looking product. However, the website is actually just buying c****, intentionally poorly made watches or similar from Kazakhstan for $4 each and charging $11 for shipping and handling. It's just stupid that this is one of the most major websites online and our ads are entirely scams and shady marketing. Like holy shit 4chans banner ads are just for dildos and h***** but at least I believe them.
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NutOfDeath Aug 10, 2016 +121
I don't know where else to ask this, but what happened to /r/apocalympics2016? Why is it private now?
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AchievementUnlockd Aug 10, 2016 +109
We're taking a look, but it appears that the top moderator simply sent the sub private. We're evaluating options at this point. Give us a couple of hours :)
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n_body Aug 10, 2016 +89
They removed all of the other mods too. I've noticed this happening more and more often - not sure how this could be effectively addressed but it's definitely a problem. edit: /r/ApocalympicsRio
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Chewbacca_007 Aug 10, 2016 +37
That's a shame. Time to put my tin foil hat on and wonder if NBC got their lawyers' fingers into the pie.
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freedaemons Aug 10, 2016 +66
More like top mod took a payoff to shut it down
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Brogelicious Aug 11, 2016 +12
/u/spez this thread has been on my front page all day, yet the trump AMA disappeared within hours. Why did a less trafficked post with a naked picture of trump stay on the front page, yet the AMA was off of it within hours?
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +14
[deleted]
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GammaKing Aug 10, 2016 +42
> In the last quarter, we’ve reduced harassment reports by 15%, spam reports by 66%, and moderator spam removals by 15%. We’ve also reduced our support ticket backlog substantially, dropping our average response time from 64 hours to 7 in the process. This seems odd, since the majority of time we still get no response at all when trying to get help with problems relating to subs I moderate. However the new mod mail seems to be a step in the right direction, well done on that.
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Indie_uk Aug 10, 2016 +23
Stop forcing me into the mobile version and suggesting the app just because I'm on mobile. I far prefer desktop and seem to have reset at least once a week, including when i google search for something on listnook. Let me tick the box permanently on my settings so if i am logged in i never have to see m.listnook.com ever again
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XxBayouWolfxX Aug 10, 2016 +416
I'm currently working on a shocking #2 myself, if the bran muffin I ate last night has any say.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +50
[deleted]
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bondinspace Aug 10, 2016 +5
Hi /u/spez, I actually have no issue with the proposed ad structures, but thanks for the continued updates. Could you please provide some clarity on when comment saving is coming to the mobile apps? This has been a feature for years and has yet to make its way over to mobile. I beg of you, please please help us out. At least let us view our saved comments on mobile...when we ask in /r/listnookmobile all they say is "soon", but they refuse to elaborate further.
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bemmu Aug 10, 2016 +11
Want me to spend money as an advertiser? Let me target ads to people who have upvoted or commented certain posts. So if I'm selling product X online and there is a post about "10 reasons why X is great", it would be valuable to reach people who have upvoted/commented on that post. Being able to target based on countries visited in the past would also be cool, because I'm interested in reaching people who have visited Japan, but I'm not sure if that's just me.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +14
Are we going to have a feature where we can set listnook to a mobile site version or desktop version permanently? It is a real hassle while I am in Safari to continuous switch from mobile Listnook to desktop version
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Osrsisignorant Aug 10, 2016 +4
Not really a fan of m.mobile. Its really hard to read comment chains or differentiate posts as the borders are non existent. Where does the first comment chain end? The green little circle is not enough. Why is the upvote button so small? Everything seems faded+meshed together. I need my borders. I like the way /.compact looks. Also its just harder to browse listnook in general. The loading times are slighty slower but the biggest deal is it cutsthe contet in half. On compact mode i see 6 posts on my screen at once. On m. I see 3. Why is it so big? I personally liked browsing listnook on desktop mode better than m.listnook
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +13
I run a support team and while your reduction is pretty impressive, it's still almost a full working day. I was able to get my team's response time down to under 2 hours and maintain a 90% customer satisfaction rate. I'm interested in the number of requests as well. We get anywhere from 300-500 cases a week, and can handle it with a team of four agents.
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AchievementUnlockd Aug 10, 2016 +28
We got just under 16,000 support tickets in the last 30 days. That's about a 20% reduction over the month prior.
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[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +14
Damn! Unfortunately I've found that support isn't something you can automate away, and since it's a cost center it's hard to justify staffing it to get that number down further. (But kudos for getting it down to 7 hours with that much volume!) I'd really love to see what your team has to deal with on a day-to-day basis, though I'm probably the only person in the world who'd care.
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AchievementUnlockd Aug 10, 2016 +24
You're not the only one, that's a request I get relatively frequently. :) Send me a DM and let's chat, I always learn something when I chat with other folks who run support teams. :)
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Wobistdu99 Aug 10, 2016 +18
Nobody is going to read this, but over the last two years as an active Listnook user here is my takeaway on Listnook's role and evolution. I just "see" the same things over and over again; old recycled photos, the same old memes, front pages loaded with pseudo "pop" narratives and more /WP, /showerthoughts and /nosleep. and a creepy fake intolerant "social justice" agenda getting the front page rammed down our throats on a daily basis. You see enough anti-vaxxer hate highly ranked and you just lose faith in the system. Perception is reality. I went from enjoying the "whimsically and intelligent slice of internet life" Listnook to using it as a barometer of stealthy corporate counter-intelligence and viral propaganda - like cynical old men reading China Daily and Pravda to understand that reality was the opposite of what the State was telling you in order to survive the next political purge. Sad. Maybe its just the inherent half-life of the average inter-tubes user; Facebook and MySpace and AOL, in that you begin to see a pattern of unwanted control and persuasion. In time that cleverness is worse when its not framed as an obvious advertisement. Another great example is just making a comment against young people "building credit" with obtaining credit cards - those counter-comments not endorsing some zeitgeist in favor of debt-slavery gets you banned from personal finance. Really!? What is going on here? I hit the random button for an experience that is clearly not random - you have to work at that. So in the quest to monetize Conde Nast's investment, I get it. You have to break some moral and ethical eggs to make an investor omelet. But Listnook (was) about projecting the Human Spirit - that (was) your brand, not building a house of mirrors for a Corporate circus sideshow that is merging with government. And that's the big question for Listnook and really everyone - picking a side - the yin or yang of the Human Spirit or Corporatism. That's the extensional question that all of these improvements have to solve - openly - for Listnook to maintain its independence, and brand respect. Work on improvements, but remember Listnook is not Google and it's a mistake to fall down the rabbit hole of merging corporate media dominated with intolerant politics and elitist agendas. Again, if these issues and ideas are truly numerically and human generated then let them be highly rated, but hiding behind "algorithms" - everyone knows what this means. Also, you guys are clearly missing the "news" space in that there is a constant stream of real-time information but filtering it through /news and /worldnews defaults is just lazy. Expect more from your MBAs. That was a lot of words. Peace and Blessings unto you.
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Nat-Chem Aug 10, 2016 +10
Nobody will see this either, but I've got some time to kill during lunch so I'll take my chances. You sound really cynical, honestly. A lot of people who rally against listnook seem overly cynical to me, these days. And I'll be the first to agree that the site has changed, but to my eyes that comes from the changing userbase more than anything. It's no longer a bastion for geeks and programmers and fringe interest groups. As the site grows in popularity, it draws in a wider spectrum of users and we see it begin to display more conservative and extreme ideas. My two cents: everybody who talks about listnook as an entity - their staff included - is missing the point. listnook is a platform, the way Twitter and Facebook are platforms. It's a hundred thousand tiny message boards hosted on the same server. Everything else is presentation. If they want to manipulate their collective feed (/r/all), *it doesn't matter* because you should know by now that /r/all is naturally only a subset of content and ultimately a poor way to experience the breadth of the site's content. The discussions about corporate influence and bias are not without value, but the communities over which they have sway are invariably those which you admit you've grown tired of: >>I just "see" the same things over and over again; old recycled photos, the same old memes, front pages loaded with pseudo "pop" narratives and more /WP, /showerthoughts and /nosleep.
10
asdlfaksjdf Aug 10, 2016 +6
I tried out the mobile app but I'm still not satisfied with them. Honestly I like the the [compact web version](http://listnook.com/.compact) over the app and even the *new* mobile site. Can we expect for the compact version to stay, or will it be eliminated after the current mobile site is up and running?
6
[deleted] Aug 10, 2016 +258
[deleted]
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