I dont understand? Iran wants to toll the strait, but they'll let ships use the other side free of charge? Why would anyone use the iranian side then?
215
AyDylo3 days ago
+148
After reading the article like 3 times.. because I found it difficult to understand too.. I think this is the key part.
>Hundreds of tankers and other ships and 20,000 seafarers have been stuck inside the Gulf since the war began on February 28.
The point the article is making is that Iran is offering to let them leave the area. The idea isn't to hold them hostage, but to implement a fee going forward. A lot of these crews currently stuck there are running out of supplies.
148
Acceptable_Noise6513 days ago
+79
Iran is offering them the chance to leave so it creates a cluster f*** for the US blockade, allowing them to slip ships past the blockade in the confusion.
79
Malbethion3 days ago
+72
> slip ships past
These ships are not racing around or risking collisions. There isn’t any “slipping” going on with ships this size.
72
plansprintrelease3 days ago
+13
Wasn’t the oman side the one that Iran presumably mined also?
13
the_jokes_on_u3 days ago
+14
Most credible intelligence that they mined the straits is coming from Iranian sources. At the current state it sounds more so like they said they mined it because you then HAVE to take the threat seriously.
No one is going to really take the risk of waters being mined.
14
isthereadrwho3 days ago
-8
If there's a collision between a super tanker and a destroyer we just lost the Destroyer
-8
marr753 days ago
+11
If there's a collision between any tanker and a destroyer, it's because the destroyer was already mobility killed and lost fire control so it was already defeated before the collision.
11
xnmyl3 days ago
+22
The US has a trillion dollar per year military budget, with the most advanced Navy in human history. You think Iran is just going to slip very large cargo ships by, going at less than 20 knots?
That is not a likely outcome
22
Scriefers3 days ago
+3
Not only is this take just wildly wrong, it is also an equally stupid thing to say and shows a serious lack of insight and critical thinking…
sLiP sHiPs PaSt ThE bLoCkAdE
These are very large, very slow moving ships. Each one (every ship on the water really) can be and is easily tracked. There are so many systems and methods used to track these ships and that’s not even counting the unknown super secret voodoo tech magic methods that the US military is privy to. And the blockade is strictly for any ships that left or are going to an Iranian harbor. Everyone else is free to come and go as they please, they only face a possible risk from Iran.
There is no slipping past the blockade. Hell the blockade doesn’t even have to be (and isn’t) all that near to the strait. Track, interdict, repeat.
Please, think again, or at least more critically, before spouting off your dribble.
3
Acceptable_Noise6513 days ago
So ships actually are not that easy to track, most of the ships that have been going through the strait of Hormuz before the blockade but during the conflict would shut off their AIS transponders to go dark, ships part of ghost fleets besides shutting off transponders will also spoof their locations to throw off tracking systems.
The problem with the blockade is that US Naval vessels can’t get too close to the straight because of Irans standoff weapons, further away they are the more dispersed their ships are too. That’s not some made up shit but something Naval brass has acknowledged being a difficultly.
Here’s a just released article explaining how an Iranian ship actually slipped past because of spoofing;
https://abcnews.com/International/ship-spoofing-iran-linked-vessel-breach-us-blockade/story?id=132056584
0
Scriefers2 days ago
+2
AIS isn’t the only way ships are tracked. There’s dedicated websites among the ultra shipping nerds that track ships via satellites. If that’s available to the public, imagine what the multi-trillion American military complex has at their disposal. Radar is also a very easy way to track ships, along with surveillance drones/planes, broadcast signal triangulation, and just good ol’ simple magnified eyesight.
Ship tracking is SUPER easy.
And your reading comprehension is absolute dog shit. The article specific says 10 ships have tried to run the blockade and all 10 were turned back. That Iranian flagged vessel just exited the strait, the narrow part between Oman and Iran, so what? That’s not the immediate location of the blockade and the vessel was forced to turn back to Iran by an American destroy anyway.
America doesn’t have to be anywhere near the strait to project this blockade, especially if it’s just targeting ships from Iranian ports. You don’t have to stop them from leaving the strait, just stop them from reaching destination, turn them back, divert them to another port, board them, commandeer, etc.
2
takesthebiscuit3 days ago
+3
It’s f****** Brutal,
I was speaking to a senior buyer for a bulk Ethanol carrier yesterday they have 10 vessels stranded there
Staff from their Dubai office are scattered over the world, some in Vietnam.
They were ordered to the airport immediately the conflict started and told to get literally the seat out to where ever.
The ships need to be manned though so the crew can’t leave
Supplies are ok tenders can come out but it’s not easy to get product into the region as the roads are awful
3
Defiant-Peace-4933 days ago
+22
The implication seems to be that ships *entering* the strait without a toll would be attacked ... which, incidentally, would be the ones that wouldn't result in an enormous spill as their tanks would be empty. Also, charging for ships already present to leave comes across as a ransom, while charging for entry is ... at least a calculable expense for the shipping companies?
22
ShoulderPast24333 days ago
+32
It's Oman territorial waters.
32
bradland3 days ago
+18
Everyone in this situation is looking for either an angle that the other side hadn't thought of (e.g., Trump playing the Uno reverso card and closing the strait), or an off ramp (e.g., Trump claiming to re-open the strait after a call with Xi). This appears to be Iran opening the door to an off-ramp, without fully capitulating.
As silly as all this seems, it matters because all of this will be written in history books, and each side needs a credible way to spin this in their favor, or they lose long term credibility within their own borders. The Iranian regime is playing a game of survival right now, and if the Republicans aren't careful, they're going to find themselves in the same position by blindly following Trump.
18
External_Counter3783 days ago
+14
How is this not Iran fully capitulating?
14
bradland3 days ago
+21
Because they can (especially domestically) claim to remain in control of their territorial waters and conveniently omit the other part in propaganda materials.
21
NatAttack509323 days ago
+7
Because it is essentially a return to the statue quo
7
intricate_strands3 days ago
+5
Because this offer is contingent on a lot of things that the USA is never going to accept.
5
h34dyr0kz3 days ago
+2
What route do large shipping vessels take through Oman territorial waters?
2
Settra_Rulez3 days ago
+1
As of today’s reporting, they still aren’t budging on the right to enrich Uranium.
1
Vegetable-Hold91823 days ago
-7
Well Iran and the regime survived a surprise attack, thats a W in most history books
-7
bradland3 days ago
+4
There is only one thing that is 100% certain: the W will be reflected differently depending upon who tells it.
4
Wide-Attorney56333 days ago
+14
"Tolling the straight" is chest thumping meant to appease radicals at home.
There's no world where we would be at peace and allow international waters to be tolled. The reason for that is once that happens everyone will start doing it and free navigation will be dead. Noone wants free navigation to be dead.
14
musci122343 days ago
+4
What if Iran promised Trump that a cut of revenue from toll will go to Trump board of peace?
Everyone agrees on what the optimal output would be. But optimal outputs were screwed twice. One the nuclear deal was screwed and then war fucked easy passage. Now most don't want to send their people to die for it.
4
greysneakthief3 days ago
+2
You sure about that? I could see a world where China essentially tolls the vicinity of SE Asia and says "Deal with it", using this very situation as justification. It could very well be that we're in an era where this sort of thing becomes status quo.
2
esperind3 days ago
+53
I think they are being facetious. And probably trying to take advantage of Trump/Americans ignorance. The only navigable part of the straight, water that is deep enough for shipping, is right next to Iran's coast.
53
fury4203 days ago
+73
> The only navigable part of the straight, water that is deep enough for shipping, is right next to Iran's coast.
You have this backwards, both the deepest areas and the normal shipping lanes are far closer to Oman than Iran, and almost exclusively within Oman's 12 mile territorial waters (or UAE's on the western approaches)
Iran's alternative path right next to their coast & islands is actually shallower, international traffic is only forced to use the Iran side because Iran claims to have mined the Omani side and middle.
73
Smok3dSalmon3 days ago
+11
Thanks for sharing facts. I didn’t know any of this
11
Daily_Heroin_User3 days ago
+1
I’ve heard the opposite actually
1
[deleted]3 days ago
+3
[deleted]
3
Daily_Heroin_User3 days ago
-6
And I should get you a spoon so you can eat my ass
-6
fury4203 days ago
+1
Yeah I've heard conflicting stuff too, that's why I double checked with a depth map.
1
2rascallydogs3 days ago
+13
The normal outbound channel through the strait entirely goes through Omani (and UAE) waters. The normal inbound channel almost entirely goes through Omani waters. This just sounds like Iran saying to China that they will open the strait without saying they will open the strait.
13
caseybvdc743 days ago
+61
Sounds like they are basically saying we will allow small boats like fishing and passenger ships through but not large commercial vessels. They want the region to feel like they are for the little guy and they are David fighting Goliath.
61
treeboy0093 days ago
+4
The region does not care its all Kingdom funds, Saudis dont care about fishing vessels.
4
Keeltoodeep3 days ago
+9
Misinformation
9
WhoSaidWhatNow20263 days ago
+16
I love that Listnook upvotes this nonsense because they want to believe it
16
WindHero3 days ago
+20
Nice cope but sounds like something you made up because you want the US to lose so badly.
"Yes, oil tankers not only can but primarily do navigate the Strait of Hormuz on the Omani side. In fact, the established Traffic Separation Scheme (TSS)—the "highway" lanes that tankers must follow to avoid collisions—is located almost entirely within Omani territorial waters."
Nice of you to talk about ignorance.
20
Yourmomsgotanass3 days ago
+8
Can't lose when you have no objective
8
usuallysortadrunk3 days ago
+6
Doesnt Omans border end right before the narrowest part of the strait which is right by Iran?
6
Eleven_inc3 days ago
+22
The original nautical shipping routes were inside of the border waters of Oman. Not sure what the guy is talking about.
22
Wide-Attorney56333 days ago
+11
u/esperind just making stuff up lol. Typical listnook. Will gain you +56 upvote differential lol
11
84Cressida3 days ago
+3
Sounds like you’re the ignorant one talking out of your ass.
3
isthereadrwho3 days ago
+2
Iran is dumping a whole bunch of ships on the US blockade and saying good luck folks
2
Shot-Toe-28843 days ago
+3
Yea why is Iran mad that they finally completed their objective of fully closing the strait?
*“Furthermore, the leverage of closing the Strait of Hormuz must definitely continue to be utilised." - Motjaba Khamenei*
Shouldn't they be popping champagne right now? They accomplished their mission more fully than they ever hoped.
3
WindHero3 days ago
+7
Obviously they don't want a full blockade they want their own ports to continue to be serviced.
They make hundreds of millions of dollars each day from oil sales, much of it probably gets pocketed by the IRGC and their leaders.
On top of that there are countless critical supplies, military and civilian, that they must import by ship.
7
philtjz3 days ago
+15
Because the Strait of Hormuz is not just a chokepoint for Gulf Arab nations, it’s also a chokepoint for Iran. Trump’s counter-blockade against Iranian imports and exports can quite literally starve the entire country because Iran relies heavily on maritime trade. All the Iranian talk of using the strait as leverage is a bluff to disguise their own vulnerabilities from the strait being weaponised against them. They’re hoping Trump will buckle first from the high oil prices before they suffer any real damage, but now that the counter blockade is in place they are looking at a real risk of economic collapse. Hence the off-ramp.
15
Dark_World_Blues3 days ago
+1
I believe there is more room to maneuver if they use the Iranian side. BTW, UAE's waters are also part of the strait's waters.
At first they wanted to toll every ship, but I am guessing they saw that their plan to toll the strait failed, so they at least want some money.
1
burgonies3 days ago
+1
Someone finally told them that the shipping channels are in Oman’s territorial waters
1
virtual_adam3 days ago
You get authentic horsht sabzi, taadig, and bomb kebab when you take the Iranian side. Might be worth $2M
0
LoneSnark3 days ago
The US might not be willing to intercept ships in Oman territorial waters.
0
BOPSurfcasting13 days ago
+2
The US warships aren't in the strait, they are just outside the strait
2
Daily_Heroin_User3 days ago
Because Iran’s side is the deep side so this is a meaningless proposal because all the ships want the deep parts.
0
sjogren3 days ago
+1
Nope
1
Be_quiet_Im_thinking3 days ago
-4
The Iranian side is the side that the big ships can go through.
-4
intricate_strands3 days ago
+37
If you read the article, they have offered this in exchange for all their demands being met.
I don't know if it changes anything for *everyone* but I know a lot of people here are not acknowledging that second and very important part of this offer.
37
Dizzy_Industry12873 days ago
+46
Key points:
– Iran proposal concerns safe exit route via Oman side of Strait of Hormuz
– Aim appears to reduce risk for outbound shipping traffic
– Details on enforcement and scope still unclear
46
Thrown_Account_3 days ago
+47
> Iran proposal concerns safe exit route via Oman side of Strait of Hormuz
The side Iran supposedly mined...
47
flyingdorito20003 days ago
+13
So they are admitting they lied
13
BigBootyWholes3 days ago
+4
And we won’t know until it’s written in the history books. Trump is so dumb he followed Israel blindly into this war without any plans whatsoever. Whether Iran actually mined the strait or not, they successfully closed it down. Iran out bluffed USA and Trump is making us look weak, especially to our real threat: China
4
GabeIsGone3 days ago
+3
International textbooks, no way US textbooks accurately record the clusterfuck of the two Trump administrations. For both political reasons (Republicans on school board will sanitize it) and practical. He’s got so many insane social posts, they could fill an entire book on its own.
3
Ct6k9c5t3 days ago
+1
I wouldn't even be mad if they lied about the mines, no mines is a good thing
1
Love-for-everyone3 days ago
+18
Listnook wont like this news...
18
zIFeathers3 days ago
+48
Okay Listnook, is Iran still winning now or where are we?
48
heyThereYou33 days ago
+63
I've lost half of my Karma recently just to say Iran's game is absolutely baseless media bullshit. IRGC is a literal paper tiger.
63
East-Ad-76653 days ago
+58
You mean to tell me AI lego videos don't help you when you're getting your shit kicked in?
58
heyThereYou33 days ago
+10
I didn't watch them at all but if it helps with constipation, I am gonna give it a try.
10
GeorgeWashingfun3 days ago
+3
The slacktivists will start protesting on Friday afternoons as well and carry two witty signs instead of just one then the Great Satan will surely fall.
3
Shot-Toe-28843 days ago
+4
pshhh, who even cares about the real world anymore. I live entirely on social media now, and Iran is clearly winning the social media war. The US will understand it has lost once it learns how to meme properly. The humiliation will be delicious.
/s
4
DexJedi3 days ago
-4
"Powerful US army not able to achieve objectives against a LITERAL paper tiger". That does not sound well.
You people only view this as military win or loss. Iran does not have to win for US to lose. They already lost if you ask me. They are trying to solve a problem they themselves created while trying to solve a problem that is abandoned.
-4
KingSwzzy3 days ago
-8
"IRGC is a literal paper tiger"
A paper tiger that shot down several planes, destroyed one of the most expensive surveillance planes in the world, destroyed millions of barrels worth of GCC production, forced the evacuation of US bases all over the middle east, destroyed destroyed infrastructure all across the middle east, including in Israel, and drained the US supply of missile interceptors.
Americans are really stress testing the whole "Pride cometh before the fall" thing.
-8
mophisus3 days ago
-9
Doesn't need to be real tiger.
Just have to make it to costly (whether materially or with lives) to keep it up.
Almost like 0 lessons were learned by this administration from Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan.
Point of the matter is Shahed Drones are c****, Iran can cause massive issues in the Strait for as long as there isnt a deal they agree with, and the U.S. Cannot bomb them out of existence/force an easy surrender because Iran already planned for that outcome.
-9
jeffreyresorts3 days ago
+17
Your comment doesnt make any sense if you actually read the article. It was an offer to allow the ships trapped in the Persian gulf to leave quickly as part of the peace deal. This hinged on washinton accepting some(unnamed) iranian demands.
Reading between the lines, this would still mean iran gets to toll the strait as an exception proves the existence of a rule.
17
VTcamperguy3 days ago
+4
The US is already allowing ships that didn’t use Iranian ports (and thus supporting Iran’s economy) to leave, so this is basically them trying to figure out a way to get their oil to market. Can’t see why the US would accept this.
4
jeffreyresorts3 days ago
-6
Thats incorrect. This is referring to Iran's blockade of the strait. Iran is not blockading their own ships.
-6
stonertear3 days ago
+5
I'm sure they'll find another way to support the Iranian regime.
5
KingSwzzy3 days ago
-9
Well let's see.
America spent billions, drained it's missile interceptor inventory, likely caused an energy crisis and further degraded it's relations with it's allies all so it could go back to the way things were 2 months ago.
So I guess it's winning in the sense that it applied a tourniquet after cutting off it's own arm.
-9
jakedublin3 days ago
-8
'you' stopped winning in November 2024.
-8
BarryMcKokinor3 days ago
-5
Well technically if you follow American oil company profit jump you could say the capital inflow to those American based companies means by proxy the U.S. is winning since it’s primarily U.S. based institutions that are the primary shareholders.
-5
katalysis3 days ago
+9
The normal navigation line for both ways goes through Oman's "side of the strait". Wtf is Iran smoking?
9
claimstoknowpeople3 days ago
+30
Oh, if an anonymous source says it, 5 minutes after an oil sell-off, who am I to argue
Edit at -1 votes: okay folks, explain to me why Iran's going to give up their only leverage for free, while continuing to blockade their own side of the strait, affecting presumably their own customers. Why are we believing an anonymous source here.
30
Familiar_Bathroom7933 days ago
+23
Because the US blockade will collapse Irans economy if it continues.
23
claimstoknowpeople3 days ago
+2
Then why continue to block / toll-gate their own side. Makes no sense: use door A for free, or pay $2 million for door B. Both doors go in the same room.
2
lollysticky3 days ago
+11
Us wont allow ships to pass through, hence no toll money. Plus, their own oil export is now also restricted. Both combined = economic disaster
11
claimstoknowpeople3 days ago
-5
That is the theory behind the US blockade, sure. The headline we're talking about here says Iran would allow ships to exit Oman side but not Iran side, which makes no sense.
-5
Keeltoodeep3 days ago
+11
Iran still needs a propaganda win. Claiming they sunk the Lincoln four times also doesn’t make sense.
11
lollysticky3 days ago
+1
Iran can claim anything it wants, but ships still wont be able to exit. And yes, we are basing ourselves on articles; who knows what actually is going on : D
1
HoustonHous3 days ago
+1
I assume they offered it in exchange for something, not for free. That's what one will do with leverage, use it...
1
claimstoknowpeople3 days ago
+1
Sure, still makes this a misleading headline
1
HoustonHous3 days ago
+1
Meh... I read it as part of the negotiations. And the first paragraph makes it even clearer. No one thinks that they are surrendering at this point. However, this is showing that they are becoimng more flexible. Some might say it's because they are starting to feel the pain, some will say they are just stalling. Either way we'll find by the end.of.the weekend as the original ceasefire is nearing the end.
1
Ultra_Metal3 days ago
+19
Trump's blockade is working. The Islamic Republic is bending to pressure.
19
UseBackground23702 days ago
+1
Almost as if this should have been the first move! The IRGC doesn't care about the Iranian people. Hitting infrastructure doesn't hurt them. It hurts the people. The IRGC's main job. Dropping bombs on Iran is mostly just going to hurt people (of course, eliminating actual evil in the process is the only good part of it). They should have started with hitting the IRGC directly: cut off their finances, kick them out of the US and other western countries, deport their offspring and nieces and nephews living it up in LA going to Coachella while our youth bleeds to death from the bullets shot by the IRGC in Iran.
1
Semyaz3 days ago
-3
“Give us everything we want, and you can use another country’s territorial waters.” Isn’t the kind of bending to pressure to brag about.
-3
rando14593 days ago
+10
I’m trying to figure out what incentive the US has for the straight to be open. The US is a net exporter of oil and controls Venezuela’s supply. Which coincidentally is the oil type US refiners are set up to process.
Trumps tariff plan made it clear he wants to increase American isolationism and increase domestic production. Disproportionately increasing the manufacturing costs of foreign competitors seems to align with that aim.
Look at which countries’ consumers pay the lowest for gasoline. Many of the top 25 countries for lowest fuel prices have suffered major damage to oil production infrastructure.
Y’all can keep pretending Trump is a total idiot with no plan and get your “attaboy” upvotes. But I’m gonna operate on the belief that Trump is a useful idiot to the MIC and American oligarchy. Some of you don’t remember or didn’t learn about D*** Cheney’s two terms as president and it shows.
10
sjogren3 days ago
+2
Bingo on all points
2
nyjets2393 days ago
+1
It's good for American oil companies but bad for Republicans because consumers get fucked.
1
rando14593 days ago
-3
Did Republican voters become sensible and rational recently?
-3
nyjets2393 days ago
+4
Bad for Republican politicians I should say.
4
rando14593 days ago
+7
I don’t think Republican voters will be swayed to vote for a Democrat because of slightly higher fuel costs.
7
oldteen3 days ago
+1
I'm guessing, almost none will flip. But since their affordability concerns are being ignored a second time, and instead, _their party_ is deliberately-making things worse, many on that side may think it's not worth the gas/stamp to vote for those who refuse to listen to their constituents. Who could blame them?
1
princemousey13 days ago
+1
That depends on whether you want a good faith answer or you prefer buying into propaganda. Freedom of navigation on the open seas has historically always been vitally important to the US Navy.
1
_WhatchaDoin_3 days ago
+5
We could consider you using the strait free of charge on the Omani side (provided that all ships fit), but let us keep our nuclear program, pay us some damages, and offer assurance that we won’t get attacked again (good luck).
5
Traskenn3 days ago
+2
Realistically could and would Iran implement a fee for navigating through the strait? So far its only the us and nobody wants to join the war but if they start f****** with the money and blowing up tankers all of a sudden people are gonna change sides real damn quick
2
aluke0003 days ago
+3
Oh yes, sail over on that other side that we littered with mines, but didn’t take record of where the mines are
3
Shot-Toe-28843 days ago
+4
Nah. They can do better than that if they want to export oil ever again. Iran should also pay reparations for the neutral civilian ships they bombed and for the cost of removing their mines from international waters. They should get down on one knee and apologize to the entire world for closing the strait and holding the entire world hostage to energy terrorism at the threat of mass-killing civilians.
"America made me do it" isn't going to cut it.
4
UseBackground23702 days ago
+1
They've been holding millions of Iranian hostage for 47 years. You guys only experienced being this regime's hostage for a few weeks and you all collectively lost your minds. Imagine being iranian and living under this...you wouldn't even be able to be on Listnook right now.
1
quipcow3 days ago
-9
There are no international waters in those straits..
-9
Green_Dream203 days ago
+10
You are not allowed to blockade a maritime entry/exit point under international law. Doesn't matter if it is your territorial waters. Turkey and UK (Gibraltar)/Spain/Morocco also follow this rule.
10
h34dyr0kz3 days ago
+6
That is not true at all. The Montreux convention explicitly gives turkey the right to close the Bosphorus and Dardanelles when they are at war or feel threatened with war
6
princemousey13 days ago
+1
Just stop negotiating with terrorists.
1
gao7on1 day ago
+1
Iran may always have this extortion card up their sleeves long after Trump is gone.
MIGA.
1
mastermindinvestor3 days ago
So traffic would continue
What about blockade by Trump outside the Hormuz?
0
HardlyW0rkingHard3 days ago
+14
The blockade was only on ships heading for Iranian ports
14
ski_it_all3 days ago
+5
The goal of the blockade is to get Iran to open the straight to free passage.
This would obviously be in exchange for lifting the blockade and would effectively open the straight up...
5
Affectionate_Bee64343 days ago
+1
It would obviously end in that case
1
Rob19653 days ago
What blockade?
0
gesti20023 days ago
+2
What murdaaah
2
sirhackenslash3 days ago
-4
You mean half the navy just sitting there not actually doing anything?
-4
joelfarris3 days ago
+2
If you look up the definition of a blockade in the military dictionaries, it's quite literally all about sitting around, flying a flag, and doing boatloads of nothingness.
2
fury4203 days ago
+1
Yeah it's an oddly archaic part of international law, a holdover from a prior era.
It's like... the closest genuine parallel to those weird sovereign citizen arguments about Admiralty law.
Effectively, if you formally declare the blockade in the right way and boat around flying the flag and doing nothing while in a position to enforce it, somehow everyone's expected to comply and you receive the authority to enforce it.
1
Optimus-PrimeRib3 days ago
-9
100% Trump will annouce that he is blockading the entire Arabian sea, which by the way, has now been renamed The Sea of America.
-9
Boys4Ever3 days ago
-6
That's like saying you can drive on the left side of the cliff yet no left side of the cliff. MAGA fools won't understand this and declare victory.
124 Comments