Everything Russia did to Ukraine that we were worried about, we are going to now do to Iran? This is wrong.
121
sack-o-matic6 days ago
+65
The Klan was elected into full control of the government and now they’re on a crusade.
65
GotRocksinmePockets6 days ago
+273
"If hostility escalates, the entire region will turn into hell for you; the illusion of defeating the Islamic Republic of Iran will become a quagmire into which you will sink."
Iran, kickin' it old school.
273
ianjm6 days ago
+52
If Iran retaliates to civilian infrastructure attacks by going after desalination plants in Saudi, Bahrain, Qatar, maybe even Israel, the entire region is fucked.
Much of the region is dependent on desalination for drinking water supply - Qatar (99%), Bahrain (90%), Kuwait (90%), Oman (86%), Israel (80%) and Saudi (70%). If they are cut off from power or physically damaged it could cause a humanitarian crisis the like of which the world has not seen in a hundred years.
For example, Riyadh almost is entirely dependent on one large plant. If it is bombed, the entire city's population (8 million people) would need to be evacuated within a month. And to where? Who knows.
Likewise, a radiological incident would obviously cause an immediate threat to health in the region, and if there is radiological fallout that could require a Chernobyl-level effort to contain.
52
GotRocksinmePockets6 days ago
+43
I completely agree. It's why no one has tried it before now. MAD can be achieved without nukes in a place the that, for their neighbours anyways.
But if they're being faced with full destruction of their infrastructure of course they'll retaliate in kind if they can. Wouldn't you? It'll be an absolute shit show, but I guess we will see. Again, why no one has tried it before.
If they go after a nuclear plant? I mean, they may as well just nuke them. Same shit different name.
It's a no win situation.
43
Abadayos6 days ago
+12
It all comes down to what your goals are.
If you want to cause suffering, civilian targets al become viable (schools, hospitals, power plants etc)
If you want to cause chaos, hitting pillars of stability becomes viable (this case desalination plants but also government buildings and actual politicians become targets via drones/carbombs/general assassination attempts).
If you just want to send a message to the world your not to be messed with: NBC assets can be used or attacked to release into the area.
All of this is MAD, however it comes down to one thing: how hard is it for the enemy to do the same thing to YOU and if the do, is the sacrifice worth the goal desired?
This is the main issue with this conflict. It’s not just Israel and the US vs Iran, it’s basically Iran taking their gloves off cos they now have nothing to loose, or very little to loose, and have the power to cripple the worlds economies by way of oil. Thy have a surprisingly strong hand the can play in the whole situation
Saying all that I just wish some sort of peace deal can be brokered before any further loss of life. Also before it gets better, we all know it will most likely,sadly, get much worse
12
Haegar_the_Horrible5 days ago
+1
The question in this case is also: Is your enemy already doing that to you/credibly threatening extinction with no believable off ramp.
So an added goal would be taking as much as possible with you on the way down (not necessarily rational, but we ARE talking about fanatics).
Beyond goals it's also a question of ability to take other actions/options available in general. The ability to make any effective deal has been neutered by both the severe loss of credibility of any US backed diplomatic endeavor and the fragmentation of Iranian power due to repeated decapitation strikes. Striking civilian targets is broadly easier than striking military ones. The US is out of range, so their regional allies are the target.
It is a predictable shit show, and like you said, it's likely to get worse before it gets any better.
1
A3800856 days ago
+8
They already hit one or 2 desal plants today.
8
Abadayos6 days ago
+1
Damn did t see that news
1
supercali456 days ago
+2
end of times then
2
henryjonesjr836 days ago
+105
“Iran will become the quagmire into which you will sink”
I mean yeah- we knew that already. Our dumbass president and Fox News host defsec didn’t though
The American public will not tolerate tens of thousands of American flag draped corpses coming back across the Atlantic
105
GotRocksinmePockets6 days ago
+86
The damage is done now. They're unlikely to just let it go... Plus, your incompetent president and defsec fired a bunch of experienced generals recently.
It can only mean they're going to either commit some war crimes from the air. Or boots on the ground coming soon, and those generals refused to do whatever they're planning.
We will see if you guys have the resolve for it once it starts happening I guess.
86
dotcomse6 days ago
-6
What exactly would you like us to do?
-6
10yearsnoaccount6 days ago
+15
Vote in the mid terms.
Your *elected leaders* are actively destroying the world order that has fuelled your success. Those who should bear checks on power have abdicated their responsibilities.
Riot in the streets if you have to.
15
FantasticTangtastic6 days ago
+66
Is that the same American public that voted for two terms for Trump?
Or the American public that's doing basically nothing whilst their president slowly destroys the entire world?
If Trump sends in ground troops then Americans will do what they always do. Argue amongst themselves and hold up signs on a street corner.
66
Better-Lunch6706 days ago
-39
And that would still be more than whatever you're pretending to do.
Downvoting on listnook will definitely change things more than protesting in the streets.
-39
Hyunkell866 days ago
+1
Say what you want about MAGAt, but at least they were willing to go and try to topple the government if they think that the government wrong them. American liberal on the other hand let trump shits of their country and hold and sign and complain. Even as ICE thugs kills at least two of them on TV. Isn’t your guns supposed to be used for toppling tyrants?
1
namafire6 days ago
-7
Theyre also the ones against owning arms so…
-7
MercantileReptile6 days ago
+5
> The American public will not tolerate tens of thousands of American flag draped corpses coming back across the Atlantic
Were I a Republican fascist, I'd ask myself: Or what?
The party has no reason to fear the population. None.
5
YearlyLemon86 days ago
+17
Crazy we're going to get a repeat Vietnam on steroids in Iran, combined with rising prices of fuel, food and likely everything else we buy due to Demented donald and his secDUI being complete f****** idiots!
17
Haze426 days ago
+2
Yes they will, and it will all be Obamas fault
2
isaacfisher6 days ago
+1
I understand where y’all coming from, but why you are sound so eager
1
Virindi5 days ago
+1
>The American public will not tolerate tens of thousands of American flag draped corpses coming back across the Atlantic
They might. I thought there would be absolutely zero support for pedophiles in public office, let alone the office of the president, but here we are.
1
chestercat19806 days ago
You will sink into the biggest quagmire anyone has ever seen before.
0
PhantasmologicalAnus6 days ago
-2
More like just dribbling shit again. Both sides are gonna sink. And everyone else will eventually be better for it.
-2
niceufo7776 days ago
-9
Yes, but the mud is falling on Iran itself; it practically doesn't have much to sustain itself. Israel and the US have hit them on almost every point, and very effectively.
-9
GotRocksinmePockets6 days ago
+10
MAD=Mutually Assured Destruction... So yeah, they know.
10
jackp0t7896 days ago
+158
So.. it's cool if the US/ Israel bombs a nuclear power plant... but totally wrong if Russia and Ukraine shell near a nuclear power plant?
158
Gryphontech6 days ago
+60
It's not, it's a war crime. The usa does many war crimes but they don't recognize the Hague soooooo....
60
So_HauserAspen6 days ago
+17
The ownership class in the US are all about changing laws to make their crimes legal.
17
BUYMEBONESTOORM6 days ago
+10
It’s really mostly the US at this point in Iran
10
G00b3rb0y6 days ago
+27
Oh if that’s destroyed, the Middle East is permanently fucked
27
Pro-Masturbator6 days ago
-9
This is the 4th time Iran has claimed its been struck, when it hasnt. They want to cause panic in the gulf state populations.
-9
G00b3rb0y6 days ago
+8
Still, we can’t ignore the dangers of even threatening to hit a nuclear power plant, so i can kinda see where Iran is coming from here
8
alien8mf15 days ago
+5
Thanks, America.
5
PenroseSyracuse6 days ago
+1
[ Removed by Listnook ]
1
Bostonterrierpug6 days ago
-3
Did anyone else scroll by too fast and read IKEA
-3
IndividualNo694206 days ago
-136
In 4 years of Ukraine war there was never a deliberate attack on a civil nuclear plant from both sides, other than a couple artillery rounds on the peripheral areas of Zaporizhzhia, and there too they had the decency to deny any deliberate attack.
-136
IntelArtiGen6 days ago
+114
> there was never a deliberate attack on a civil nuclear plant from both sides
Are you including the live video we were all able to watch of Russia attacking ZNPP for hours?
https://www.npr.org/2022/03/11/1085427380/ukraine-nuclear-power-plant-zaporizhzhia
By chance the reactors were not hit because ukrainians defended the administrative buildings but clearly Russia attacked ZNPP to get it, the plant was defended, they took it by force and didn't care about the danger it posed. And I guess because there was no (big enough) international reaction and nobody cared and people don't even remember, anyone can do that now, and americans could do the same on Bushehr and surely nobody would care. Obviously, hopefully, it won't happen, I'm exaggerating to make a point.
But it'll be hard for Russia or China or Iran to complain when they directly or indirectly did the same in Ukraine. Remember a Shahed drone hit the Chernobyl Confinement structure. I don't remember seeing Iran complain when it happened. So what's the rule? It's ok to attack NPPs and send drones on confinement structures... but only in Ukraine? Also Russia used Chernobyl buildings to protect their soldiers and vehicles, and they're using ZNPP buildings for the same purpose. https://united24media.com/latest-news/russia-uses-ukrainian-nuclear-plant-to-entrench-troops-and-vehicles-photos-reveal-13156
114
PeteSampras_MMO6 days ago
+84
Don't forget the chernobyl attack by Russia.
Chernobyl Nuclear Power Plant drone strike - Wikipedia https://share.google/qVFM1ixkVvD7rOutV
84
IntelArtiGen6 days ago
+21
Yeah I updated my post.
And to be fair nuclear facilities have also been attacked in Iran obviously, these places should never be attacked and should never be used for illegal purposes.
21
IndividualNo694206 days ago
-69
Deliberate attack is a bad expression, English is not my first language, let's say a declared attack, official, no plausible deniability... We do not attack to destroy a nuclear plant and make it a war goal
-69
truttatrotta6 days ago
+30
Ah FSB rubles it is. Are you sitting there cheering as thousands of Russians die every week for absolutely nothing?
30
truttatrotta6 days ago
+22
Weird because I sat and watched live video of Russia bombing a nuclear plant.
I have no idea why people keep trying to pretend Russia hasn’t done absolutely every type of atrocity in Ukraine. FSB rubles maybe.
22
Horat1us_UA6 days ago
+42
You are living in a bubble if you don’t know about chornobyl attack and ZNPP attacks and still talk about it
42
xieta6 days ago
-21
Folks, this is why you don’t listen to anyone selling “deaths per GWh” as evidence of nuclear’s safety.
Long tail risk.
47 Comments