This is not the whole reason, the article is kinda misleading. Lufthansa closes its unprofitable city liner (short haul) group, which was planned to be closed next year anyway. The workers went on a long strike again and LH just pulled the closing date forward. Fuel prices are just a part of the reason to pull this off rather sooner than later
649
Crood_Oyl2 days ago
+109
yeah this needs to be higher. I don't think people know.
109
superurgentcatbox2 days ago
+39
Yeah, I just got rebooked into a different flight. So sure my original flight was cancelled but now I’m just taking a flight at a different time the same day.
39
HillarysFloppyChode2 days ago
+30
This. I see people post all over TikTok that flights are being cancelled by Lufthansa, while failing to mention that Lufthansa is already in a strike.
30
Coneskater2 days ago
+24
Lufthansa has fucked any German airport that isn’t Munich or Frankfurt. One of their executives took over AirBerlin and then they declared bankruptcy.
It’s wild to me that here in Hamburg a city of 2 million people (Germany's second largest), most flights are just to connect to one of the Hubs of Munich or FRA. Zero transatlantic routes..
24
Saphrex2 days ago
+37
Yeah, it's because Hamburg is right in the middle of the big hubs like AMS, CPH and BER. Also flights are not allowed after 23:00, very bad for long haul. United tried, but failed in 2018 due to low passenger demand. The main function now is to connect to Dubai and Doha
37
Coneskater2 days ago
+5
BER is hardly a hub. They wanted it to be one when they built it, and maybe if AirBerlin didn’t go bankrupt it could have been one but it’s also now a glorified regional airport.
5
SkiingAway2 days ago
+3
It's only been open for a couple of years and growth in enplanements has been decent.
I don't know that it's going to be the top-tier hub that it was originally planned to be (certainly not in the near future, even before this crisis), but an airport with >150 destinations and >50 countries served is not what I would call a "glorified regional airport" either.
3
Coneskater2 days ago
+2
I mean, I think we can agree that everything surrounding the planning and construction of the BER was an absolute shit show. If you haven't listened to it, I HIGHLY recommend checking out the [podcast: How to F*** up an Airport.](https://www.radiospaetkauf.com/ber/)
For example they rebuilt a lot of the gates to be compatible with the Airbus A380* even though no airline ever indicated they would fly
there.
And by Hub I mean few people connect in Berlin.
> Based on available traffic reports, Berlin Brandenburg Airport (BER) functions primarily as an origin and destination (O&D) airport rather than a major transfer hub, with a low percentage of connecting passengers. While exact, up-to-date transfer percentages for 2025/2026 are not explicitly highlighted in recent reports, the overwhelming majority of passengers start or end their journey in Berlin. [Source](https://www.routesonline.com/airports/2515/berlin-brandenburg-airport/news/299662564/2307-million-passengers-travelled-via-ber-last-year/#:~:text=Aletta%20von%20Massenbach%2C%20Chief%20Executive,year%20for%20long%2Dhaul%20connections.)
Fixed a typo
2
SkiingAway2 days ago
+3
> If you haven't listened to it, I HIGHLY recommend checking out the podcast: How to F*** up an Airport.
Oh I have. I hate podcasts but that was both entertaining and (darkly) hilarious. Probably wouldn't be so funny if I was German and it was my taxpayer money wasted.
(Also I assume you mean the A380 not the A350).
3
Coneskater2 days ago
+3
Ah yes sorry, typo- fixed that one.
3
Consistent-Gap-35452 days ago
+7
What’s even crazier is that there are no viable Rail&Fly options out of Hamburg. I’d *much* rather take a train to Copenhagen or Frankfurt than take a short haul flight but the only way this can work is if you give yourself like five hours of buffer time because the trains in Germany are so unreliable. Also the fact that there’s no direct train connection between Hamburg and Amsterdam is like the joke of the century (like how there’s no normal commuter train between Hamburg and Berlin and you’re forced to book a 100€ ICE).
7
Coneskater2 days ago
+4
Rail and fly that has flexibilty that means if your train is delayed on the way to the airport, it's not your fault and the airline has to rebook you at no additional cost / inverse would be so helpful.
Right now if there are connections I don't trust it because when the train is late, I'm SOL if I miss my flight.
4
Exoduc2 days ago
+2
Does the others fly directly to Madrid though? I know Iberia do from Hamburg.
2
Coneskater2 days ago
+7
All German airports fly to two places: Frankfurt and Spain( mostly Mallorca on the kind of flight where people clap when the land)
7
GreenHorror42521 day ago
+2
> It’s wild to me that here in Hamburg a city of 2 million people (Germany's second largest), most flights are just to connect to one of the Hubs of Munich or FRA. Zero transatlantic routes..
It's not wild at all. You can't expect long-haul flights from every little airport. Even in the US, only a small handful of airports have transatlantic flights.
2
Coneskater1 day ago
Did you miss the part where I said it's the second biggest city in Germany with a population of over 2 million.
Btw only four US cities have a population exceeding 2 million: New York City, Los Angeles, Chicago, and Houston
0
lolofaf2 days ago
+3
It seems a bit odd to strike when you know your jobs are all being cut within a year tbh. Maybe hindsight 20/20, but did they not expect that a strike could trigger earlier layoffs?
3
HahaCharlieKirkHaha1 day ago
+2
Yeah, Lufthansa’s been having other troubles, but the fuel price is definitely an issue too.
Air Transat (a Canadian airline, mostly doing d******* vacation travel) announced yesterday that they’re cutting 1000 flights over the summer due to the price of fuel.
2
BigBirdsBrain2 days ago
+690
Yeah this feels like where things are heading, less c**** flights and more planning ahead. Trains for short trips might actually make more sense now.
690
a_dolf_in2 days ago
+394
The issue is that this was not achieved by trains becoming more affordable but the flights getting more expensive - in the end those who already have the least will be fucked.
394
BigBirdsBrain2 days ago
+167
Yeah that’s the part people miss. Prices going up without better alternatives just squeezes the same people every time.
167
a_dolf_in2 days ago
+84
Just to give you an example, from where I live to venice is 30-50€ for a return flight using Ryanair which is ok for this short a trip. By train it's 80€ and upwards for one way tickets.
Sure, the train is more comfortable. But is the comfort going to make up for the extra time i need to get there?
"But there are night trains where you can sleep" - sure, a berth is 340€ last time i checked. One way.
84
bbbbbbbbbblah2 days ago
+31
The gap is even more ridiculous in the UK. I can get flights to the area I grew up in for £14 with Ryanair, one way. The train is closer to £150-£200 return and that is including navigating the kafkaesque ticketing system. The train is a lot slower, though you probably aren’t saving any time after going through security at the airport
The government made a lot of fanfare out of the fact that train fares are frozen this year - yeah great
31
a_dolf_in2 days ago
+18
Here in austria we have a good rail system. But last year i was in china and it has ruined my perspective you could say.
The train ticket from Beijing to Xian, 4 hour ride going 350km/h. For me it was 68€ (IIRC) in first class, for locals and in 2nd class it would have been much cheaper. I was told about 3€.
Can you imagine 3€ for a 4 hour train ride? The ticket fare to get to the main station here is 3.40€ if you dont have a pass.
Now if i have to add the time to get to the airport, security, boarding, etc... i am sure the train was faster.
18
smalldog2572 days ago
+7
No, second class tickets are around €68, first class are €109. There are much slower trains from €18. No way is there a €3 ticket.
7
Vaeltaja822 days ago
+5
I travel in China often by train and it is indeed one of the things that they are doing really really well there.
However 3€ is not possible. I'd guess it was maybe around 150-300rmb so 20-45€ for the cheaper tickets.
First class is actually the middle class there and business is one tier higher. There the tickets can get pretty expensive but also the service and comfort are excellent.
5
hebrewchucknorris2 days ago
+13
Going city center to city center and avoiding airports is a massive + for trains, especially considering the 2-3 hours you're expected to arrive at the airport in advance of your flight. Trains you just show up 10 mins before and go.
13
arbitrary_fox2 days ago
+4
This! I always hate flying into London unless it’s City because I lose so much time getting to the client and it’s always for a half day meeting. So I considered taking the train because a day trip was anyway off the cards and it was 3x the flight like no way can I justify it..
4
StinkMaster902 days ago
+1
Exactly as intended by the people profiting from it all. What a mess
1
BeerPoweredNonsense2 days ago
+20
The counter argument is that flights get a massive subsidy - kerosene is not taxed. So travel prices have been artificially kept down.
20
No_Doubt_About_That2 days ago
+7
> trains
> affordable
The UK train network: Pick one
7
a_dolf_in2 days ago
Is there an "affordable" option for anything in the investment bank with a military that is the UK state?
0
TomokoNoKokoro2 days ago
+3
Yeah but consider that European short-haul flying has been so subsidized for so long that this is just revealing what was always true - flights are expensive economically and in terms of environmental impact, and trains always needed to be priced as the cheaper and more green option that they always were.
3
TheBusStop122 days ago
+2
You're also shit out of luck if you live in Ireland or Finland, with no train connections to the rest of Europe. Tho at least for Finland when Rail Baltica finally finished you could take the ferry from Helsinki to Tallinn first and then hop on the train. But that will still take some years
2
oli_ramsay2 days ago
+3
I'm sure as the demand for trains increases, so will ticket prices. Shareholders need their dividends
3
Christron99902 days ago
+48
Forcing us off the £50 flights and onto the £120 trains, great.
48
BigBirdsBrain2 days ago
-6
No one’s forcing anything, airlines cut routes when they stop making money. Prices go up when demand stays high and options shrink.
-6
Christron99902 days ago
+20
Public transport isn’t really an option for people in a hundred different contexts, and should be affordable. This bullshit that we as the public need to make sure these businesses are wildly profitable and specifically not serving our needs is just nonsense. I totally appreciate airlines serve holiday culture a lot, but it just irks me that we’re literal fish in a barrel to these businesses.
20
FalconX882 days ago
+10
>and more planning ahead.
Exactly the opposite. You can't plan ahead if they then simply cancel your flight because they don't feel like doing it.
10
TheBlack20072 days ago
+7
Any chance they are cancelling flights to re-sell the seats more expensively?
7
flextendo2 days ago
+6
Thats exactly whats going to happen. „Here have a voucher for your canceled flight for x“ - a month later „oh we have added more flights back in, its now x +1000“. F*** these airlines and especially Lufthansa. I already decided like a decade ago to not book flights with them anymore.
6
Wranorel2 days ago
+2
Depends. Lots of times a train price is double or more of the same destination. A 2-hour flight can be a 20-hour train (try south of Italy to France. It’s 55 euros with a flight, 300 euros with trains. 10 times the time).
This is a lose-lose situation for all.
2
fdesouche2 days ago
+2
Train prices will go higher too .
2
narmol2 days ago
+2
You guys have trains?
2
Ok_Love94612 days ago
+1
Very jealous as I sit over here in the USA. There's one train per day in my town at it leaves at 11:00 at night.
1
ClaroStar1 day ago
+1
After decades of the world shrinking with easy access to c**** and fast transportation, the world now seems to be expanding with transportation getting more expensive. I'm not sure my kids will get to see the world like I did.
1
BigBirdsBrain1 day ago
+1
Yeah it’s getting pricier, but travel isn’t disappearing. People will just be more selective and intentional about it.
1
ClaroStar1 day ago
+1
That makes travel less accessible. My point exactly.
1
atalexradu2 days ago
-5
Trains make sense only in theory, where it's very easy to state something like you did.
In practice, trains cannot be an option due to their limited number (train schedules are made in advance for 1 year), limited seating options, and quite high costs outside of a national subscription plan to use them.
I will give a practical example from Austria, having one of the most developed train infrastructure in Europe: Vienna to München by train is over 4h long, costs upwards of 90€ one way, same distance by plane takes only 1h at 150€.
This is one of the best international train line connection, if you replace München with Belgrade, Prague, Venice, Zurich etc. the shock of train travel time length and costs is actually scary.
-5
amateur_mistake2 days ago
+65
This is one of those fun moments when futures markets not matching actual prices gets to have real effects.
Trump can make weird proclamations that somehow "reduce" the price of fuel but that shit is all on Wall street. In the real world, companies have to actually pay for fuel at its current value.
65
DestroyedByLSD252 days ago
+12
Real companies actually do buy futures though. Airlines buy the vast majority (think 80-90%) of their fuel as futures contracts. It was a hedge for companies first and a speculative vehicle later. Not all of them do it though.
[https://weekly.visualapproach.io/p/the-airlines-that-do-and-do-not-hedge-fuel](https://weekly.visualapproach.io/p/the-airlines-that-do-and-do-not-hedge-fuel)
12
amateur_mistake2 days ago
+1
Very interesting article. Of course, from that chart, Lufthansa is almost 77% hedged. So clearly it didn't work the way they wanted it to. Since they are cutting flights. Presumably the complications of the real world are causing problems.
1
crossdtherubicon2 days ago
+8
Nice point! The investment markets are not "the economy". This is much more of an American thing but unfortunately, the world's economy is based on the US economy in many ways.
8
KebabAnnhilator2 days ago
+55
Scaremongering.
Lufthansa were closing this line anyway. They have just moved that date forward.
55
NotSure___2 days ago
+11
If I remember the original article, the employees from the closed airline (subsidiary of lufthansa) were protesting the closure. And it looks like Lufthansa called their bluff and closed the airline 1 year earlier then planned.
11
Spicy_Wings2 days ago
+13
20,000 flights is equal to 1% of their schedule. And the bulk of the numbers come from the accelerated closure of cityline which was due to close 2028. Doomsayers
13
FalconX882 days ago
+1
>And the bulk of the numbers come from the accelerated closure of cityline which was due to close 2028.
They still sold the tickets for those flights. I had a flight with them, now I have to pay an additional night of hotel or cancel the trip.
1
VelvetPressure2 days ago
+26
Between fuel prices and climate pressure, this is probably the new normal. Anyone with summer plans should double-check bookings and maybe look at trains for shorter routes before everything gets snapped up.
26
CatchPersonal71822 days ago
+33
Flights are booked 6 months in advance to get a good deal. 2 months ago there was no war with Iran, people taking these flights did not know that
33
crossdtherubicon2 days ago
+7
For the last year at least, I've not really noticed significant price differences for early bookings.
I've been tracking several standard flights that used to be pretty c**** but, the prices have been much higher in general, without much difference in booking early or not.
7
HillarysFloppyChode2 days ago
+10
That’s not the whole story with Lufthansa.
They just closed the short haul service they are running, and have been on strike, forcing cancellations across Europe.
10
Wisteriafic2 days ago
+1
Last week I booked Atlanta-Dubrovnik for June, via Turkish Airlines. I was nervous about committing to the trip, but I figured that fares would only go up.
1
b1argg1 day ago
+1
Is unfortunate that trains in most of the US are complete ass
1
[deleted]2 days ago
-3
[deleted]
-3
mysticzoom2 days ago
+1
If your crossin continents, then start making contingency plans.
Asia gets most of its fuel from the Middle East. If this continues, in three weeks, you might not have a way to get back, depending on where you go.
1
cwicheck2 days ago
+3
hey, maybe that's the way to prevent climate change!
3
HenrJackyson2 days ago
+9
And THIS is exactly what happens when the people of the usa vote for an incapable idiot as their next president.
And THIS is also what happens when you fail to prosecute a war criminal such as Netanyahu and give him free reign to do as he pleases.
The result? The rest of the world has to pay for their narcissist egos. As usual the consequences of the actions of the 'mighty' end up with the commoners.
Thank you people of the Divided States of America and the thank you to the people that we set free in '45.
9
Macho_Magyar2 days ago
+1
Couldn't have said it better than this.
1
Jlx_272 days ago
Thanks a lot orange man! 🍊
0
Equivalent-Resort-632 days ago
+1
Looks like transatlantic sailing may soon come back into vogue.
1
Popular_Wrangler94222 days ago
They cant just get $500 million from their government like spirit?
0
Call555JackChop2 days ago
I’m trying to book an east coast to Vegas plane ticket for 2 right now and it’s over $3000 it’s insane
0
tulaero231 day ago
Less travel more people ignorant about other's culture.
75 Comments