ListNook

Novel-Lifeguard6491 17 hr ago +1230

The most significant thing Macron said wasn't about Lebanon specifically, it was the warning that the EU could suspend the association agreement that has governed trade with Israel since 2000.

1230

G00b3rb0y 16 hr ago +417

Holy shit that would be massive

417

killerkingbee9 16 hr ago +181

The EU talks big, but they really want Israeli military and tech. Just ask Greece.

181

Valtremors 12 hr ago +132

You must remember, EU is a union, not a country. While we have certain agreements, other things are also independent actions of these countries. But you wouldn't be wrong to call out weapons trade issue. But it would be wrong to claim it is a core value of the union itself. ...What I mean that things can change but it is hard to bar member contries from trading with Israel without strongarming, and that is what Euroskeptics eat for breakfast.

132

EnjoyerOfBeans 8 hr ago +1

Brother, the EU is a trade union. That's exactly what it was created for and it's well within reason for the EU as a whole to sanction Israel. EU member states have no autonomy when it comes to trading with non-member states, unless there exists some agreement that says otherwise.

1

ImperitorEst 13 hr ago +23

One thing that gets overlooked a lot is that the entire EU law enforcement ability to access locked phones is based on Israeli tech. There aren't any other peer competitors on that area right now.

23

Ok_Acanthaceae5986 12 hr ago +13

that's mostly for spying after journalists and such though?

13

ImperitorEst 10 hr ago +8

I mean phones once the police take them. So drug dealers, murderers, rapists, all domestic criminals

8

EnjoyerOfBeans 8 hr ago +1

Not like half of EU has had controversies regarding Pegasus misuse... It's all for our safety after all.

1

tackle_bones 7 hr ago +1

Didn’t US companies buy a lot of these Israeli companies recently, and don’t the US and EU have fairly competent competitors to these companies?

1

machopsychologist 13 hr ago +35

Thinking out loud here but ... do they still need the Israelis if they have Ukraine? 🤔

35

mdedetrich 12 hr ago +38

Oh yes, Israeli has some of the best tech (aside from US) when it comes to intercepting ballistic/cruise missiles, think Iron Dome and all of its layers. Ukraine has the most cost effective tech when it comes to intercepting drones but is completely reliant on other countries for other types of threats.

38

Tavrin 12 hr ago +15

France and Italy have SAMP/T NG tho, and they'd obviously love to sell it more to European partners

15

mdedetrich 11 hr ago

True, but they don't have it on the amount of scale that Ukraine needs and while the systems are in the same category they don't have the exact same capabilities. Patriot is better than SAMP/T NG when it comes to long range ballistic defense at the cost of being less mobile and having less coverage, and right now its really Patriot that Ukraine needs as its ballistic missiles (Kalibr) that is causing the biggest problems. In particular the high missile capacity of the Patriot is its biggest advantage over SAMP/T NG right now, as the easiest way to get through interceptors is to just saturate the defense by shooting more missiles/drones at once, and Patriot having a bigger missile capacity is more resistant to that. It is unfortunate, but there really isn't a system out there that is comparable to Patriot. Honestly if you were to design a weapon system from scratch for what Ukraine actually needs the most, it would a Patriot with its strengths even more exaggerated and its weaknesses as well, so they could plant these systems near power stations/transformers. Ukraine doesn't need an ultra mobile anti-air defense so much (which is what SAMP/T NG does). The German Skyranger might fullfill this niche better (albeit being better against drones but worse against ballistic missiles, more designed for cruise missles), but again this is an entirely new system that doesn't have any real scale.

0

mopthebass 10 hr ago +6

>high missile capacity of the Patriot Barely 700 of these things are built annually, good luck keeping your capacity filled

6

mdedetrich 9 hr ago +2

Thanks to the Iran war, sure, but that figure is still well behind SAMP/T NG. I mean I am not even talking about the missiles, the amount of SAMP/T NG launchers themselves is vastly under the amount needed.

2

Zdzisiu 12 hr ago +7

So who's in EU buying Israel's intercepting systems?

7

Magical_Pretzel 11 hr ago +20

Germany. https://www.euronews.com/2025/12/03/germany-activates-first-elements-of-arrow-3-missile-defence-system-bought-from-israel Romania https://defence-industry.eu/romania-selects-israels-rafael-to-supply-air-defence-system-in-e1-9-billion-project/ Czechia https://armyrecognition.com/news/army-news/army-news-2024/first-shipment-of-israeli-spyder-air-defense-missile-systems-arrives-in-czech-republic Finland https://norskluftvern.com/2025/11/25/finlands-air-defense-transformation-from-neutral-defender-to-natos-northern-anchor/

20

Nosiege 12 hr ago -8

> think Iron Dome and all of its layers. hasn't that been consistently being breached recently? Seems like it's perhaps not the cutting edge it used to be.

-8

shineyink 12 hr ago +29

The iron dome is not designed to stop long range ballistic missiles... There are other systems for that - David's sling, Arrow 3.

29

mdedetrich 11 hr ago +18

It has an interception rate of 90%+, which is as high as physically possible when it comes to interception. Its impossible to get 100%+ interception rate

18

BigLittlePenguin_ 8 hr ago +1

The Israeli Defense industry is top notch, Ukraine doesnt have a lot in terms of spy software and if they do, Israel got better

1

xmuskorx 14 hr ago +15

I mean, also pushing Israel to seek alliance with Russia and/or China is probably not the just move...

15

danield1302 12 hr ago +14

Other EU members would block that. Mainly Germany and Austria. It's just lip service as usual.

14

ihavestrings 14 hr ago -12

"France said". They couldn't even kick Israel out of the Euro song festival.

-12

MissPandaSloth 13 hr ago +18

If you mean Eurovision, Israel is literally main sponsor of it, so realistically whole thing would be done. Which is an option, ofc, but ending it is a little different than "just kicking one country out".

18

ihavestrings 13 hr ago +1

I remember a couple of countries supporting Israel.

1

badass_panda 16 hr ago +227

I love how involved France wants to be with Lebanon, and how much Lebanon doesn't value that or want it or really benefit from it.

227

elpokitolama 10 hr ago +37

French here, it's more the opposite actually France took a shockingly long time to act given our historical ties to Lebanon and still only barely dares to say that they want Israel to back down without for now backing words with actual diplomatic action - declaring the fact that we may intend to take economic actions is not the same as actually bringing to topic back on top of the emergencies to be dealt at EU level

37

Salazard260 13 hr ago +99

The Lebanese president was literally just in France yesterday

99

Snoutysensations 16 hr ago +189

A lot of the Arab world still hates France for killing a million Algerians back in the 1950s and being a generally oppressive colonial power in other regions. Note that France was Israel's primary foreign benefactor before the US took over. That's their perception, at least.

189

Agile_Perception_604 13 hr ago +70

Why would Arabs themselves an oppressive colonial power be pissed about France being an oppressive colonial power?

70

Upstairs-Basis9909 11 hr ago +55

Because that’s just human nature and no one seems themselves as the oppressor?

55

TheLastSamurai101 9 hr ago +9

Arabs are pissed off at France for oppressing them, not for being an oppressive colonial power generally. But that's the point. Why should they view France positively?

9

Fusilero 16 hr ago +58

You could have said this in 1886, 1920 and 1971 and no one would have blinked.

58

badass_panda 16 hr ago +15

Yep, that's true for sure.

15

Tavrin 11 hr ago +43

You're talking out of your ass, Lebanese president was literally at the Elysée yesterday for a talk and conference with Macron. Lebanon has no leverage on it's own nor any experience negotiating and they know it. Israël also knows it and knows France's support would change the balance of powers in those talks, that's why they are trying to keep France as far away from the negociations as possible.

43

Stunning-Astronaut72 10 hr ago +2

Because france and lebanon always had very strong and tight relations since the crusade times. Lot of people in lebanon speak french, and there is also a strong community in france.

2

GoingAllTheJay 8 hr ago +1

40% of Lebanon is francophone. It's not a mystery. That's why Shawarma is amazing in Montreal and Ottawa, but sucks the further you go west in Canada. As soon as you lose your ratio of Lebanese people, the Garlic gets too weak.

1

Educational-Art-8515 15 hr ago -14

It's about domestic politics. The percentage of the population who follow Islam has grown from 0.5% in 1985 to approximately 10% today. It's not a particularly success integration either - more than half of them want to see Islamic law imposed too...

-14

Slimmanoman 15 hr ago +43

No it's not. There are deep ties between France and Lebanon specifically

43

HarshComputing 14 hr ago +14

Namely colonial ties. As Lebanon was a French mandate

14

Slimmanoman 13 hr ago +18

That's very oversimplified and not even really correct. "In 1920, soon after the end of World War I, the League of Nations mandated that Lebanon would be administered by France after the Partition of the Ottoman Empire. Lebanon officially became part of the French empire, as part of the French Mandate for Syria and Lebanon, and was administered from Beirut. Lebanon was not a “colony” of France. Rather, it was part of and administered by France. Lebanese people could ask for French citizenship and were treated as equal to French nationals" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France%E2%80%93Lebanon_relations

18

HarshComputing 12 hr ago +5

A mandate is a colonial institution, that much is just a simple fact, the French ruled over Lebanon out of a colonial mindset that the Lebanese were not able to govern themselves. Now here is my subjective take: the term 'mandate' is a post WWI whitewashing of the term colony that traditional colonial powers used to both take new colonies from the Ottoman Empire and appease the US and their pesky concept of self determination of nations. No wonder all 'mandates' ceased to be a thing right after WWII right alongside traditional colonies.

5

Slimmanoman 11 hr ago +5

The mandate was 100 years ago and lasted 25 years. The history started much before that, and since then a lot of things happened and the French - Lebanese relations have always been great and tightening. It's a reality that ties are strong and countries are friendly. Lots of cooperation on trade, military, diplomacy, immigration etc. And almost no one in both countries sees the relation under the prism of "colonialism" these days. I'm curious, are you French or Lebanese ? It's really uncommon in my life to hear Lebanese people talk or care about the mandate, I'm wondering if it's a diaspora / home thing or if you're not representative. (I'm French)

5

Chowder110 12 hr ago +2

So did the turks but i dont see the lebanese cry about them

2

WarmGreenGrass 14 hr ago +19

agree or disagree with macron, but this is simply delusion lol. france’s muslim minority isn’t puppeteering macron into doing this

19

SalutLesAmies 13 hr ago +18

It's OK not to know anything about France's domestic politics, and nobody expects you to. But please don't try to comment on it if you're not familiar with it, because you end up writing ignorant comments like this.

18

J_Kant 15 hr ago +15

The percentage in the North or South America isn't significant but you'll still find those countries increasingly taking the same positions as Macron.

15

millelizards 18 hr ago +264

I’m still waiting for one of those concerned with Lebanon to suggest a way to deal Hezbollah.

264

BBorc 13 hr ago +98

Ironically, France was one of the members of the UN Security council that unanimously voted on Resolution 1701 in 2006 to remove Hezbollah from southern Lebanon. Since UNFIL and Lebanon have been unable to do that for 20 years, Israel has had to finally deal with the terorists on their border.

98

jataba115 13 hr ago +52

Just showing that UN Security Council resolutions are useless. Everyone’s already known that

52

earblah 8 hr ago +1

Obviously the Lebanese government is going to need support in combating Hezbollah Displacing a million people is just a recruitment drive for Hezbollah

1

comeonbjxgo 17 hr ago -40

According to Listnook South Lebanon is a liberal paradise that has yet to reach its potential due to Israel and the US. Population of Southern Lebanon is 97% women and children. 2% male medics, and 1% non gender conforming Hezbollah

-40

jeffreyresorts 17 hr ago +81

Bro you look so strong knocking that strawman over. Bibi would be proud

81

dontknow_anything 15 hr ago -22

Certainly not taking over Lebanon. You don't get to take over someone house, just because their kid threw stone at your house. Or beat some to the very inch of their life, just cause they slapped you.

-22

jataba115 13 hr ago +38

I love a good analogy but this is a very stupid way to look at it and you shouldn’t try to just say hezbollah is just a kid in your neighbor’s house

38

NoHetro 13 hr ago +22

They have threw countless rockets and killed Israelis living in the north, it's not about the effectiveness it's about intent, they constantly spout destruction to all Israel and for all Jews to die and by they I'm talking about Iran and all its proxies such as hezbollah.

22

vegeful 14 hr ago +49

So what? What will stop it? Just accept rocket being aim at?

49

ihavestrings 14 hr ago +46

"stones" You mean rockets. According to the 2006 ceasefire Hezbollah should have disarmed and leave South Lebanon. Bu go ahead and call it "throwing tones"

46

MartinB105 13 hr ago +21

You're just another of the countless people telling others what they should NOT be doing, with zero clue as to what any better alternative might be. If you don't have any ideas, then just admit that the people dealing with the situation know how to do so better than you do.

21

Illicitline45 11 hr ago -11

If Russia isn't allowed to invade another country and take over its territory, neither is Israel, I really don't understand the double standards here

-11

Jeovah_Attorney 11 hr ago +18

Maybe that an armed force is bombing Israel from south Liban, while no such thing happened from Ukraine? Don’t get me wrong, I abhor the IDF but you are clearly arguing in bad faith here

18

eyl569 9 hr ago +2

I must have missed it when Ukraine started lobbing missiles at Eussia before the war.

2

faffc260 17 hr ago +204

look, israel has made peace and **kept peace** with jordan and egypt since the 67 war pretty much, lebanon has not made official peace since 1948 when lebanon was part of the coalition that invaded israel, nor has syria, lebanon hosts a terrorist militia that regularly initiates attacks against israel likely at the behest of their backers, the iranian government. if france wants israel to leave, they should help the lebanese government disarm hezbollah, probably directly, and then urge the proper government in lebanon to make a peace deal and enforce their population into not breaking it.

204

gayphilantropist 17 hr ago +64

Doing anything is not their forte. Just posture, take the moral high ground, criticize, and sanction. At least I agree with European sanctions, they work.

64

protossaccount 14 hr ago +9

That’s what this is, just macron playing politics. He isn’t getting anything done. I wonder who in France he is appealing to by acting like this.

9

eek_a_shark 14 hr ago +35

The large block of Muslim immigrants

35

protossaccount 14 hr ago +1

I figured. It’s the same divisive BS that we see Trump pulling. It’s appealing to bases for control.

1

shemichell 17 hr ago +22

Why can’t we all just live our 70 years on this earth and be happy and not fight. It’s not 1920 anymore. We have friends we talk to all over the world. I’m just sad. Sad for my kids. Just sad.

22

Gathered22 10 hr ago +11

Tell that Israel when the next October 7 or an Intifada happens, i bet they would love it as much as you if they could just live their life, but terrorists doesnt make it as easy.

11

telef0nmann 9 hr ago +1

israel does weekly october 7ths in gaza, this excuse doesnt fly anymore

1

MarkMew 13 hr ago +6

How the f*** can one even follow these beefs at this point...

6

killerkingbee9 16 hr ago +4

Just an absolutely great point. One that Macron has no answer for.

4

underage_female 14 hr ago -17

Israel. Globally known for making and keeping peace. :D How you can write that while not bursting into laughter is quite amazing. Even their strongest allies are condemning Israel's neverending expansion resulting in perpetual war with neighbours. Its ok for you to do the same.

-17

Karpattata 14 hr ago +34

You haven't really refuted the point that peace Israel makes with neighbors is kept. Again, the Egypt and Jordan agreement have held for decades.

34

oldspice75 18 hr ago +86

any comment on Hezbollah's ambitions?

86

ArchitectNebulous 17 hr ago +67

Never, as is usual.

67

Haunting_Pop_749 16 hr ago +42

France should just help Lebanon instead, rather than simping Hezbollah because not wanting rising fuel prices whatever, get rid Hezbollah then maybe Israel will happily leave Southern Lebanon.

42

DanIvvy 17 hr ago +105

Cool so just accept never ending rocket fire from Lebanon? Many parts of the conflict overall are complicated but the Lebanon stuff isn’t. Lebanon could be like Jordan and Egypt, or if they want to still be little bitches, like Syria, but they don’t. Not being in conflict with Israel is a unilateral option Lebanon could take (yes, Hezbollah are Lebanese). It’s the fault they don’t.

105

gayphilantropist 17 hr ago +94

Hey France, your ex colony is used as a launching pad for rockets fired by terrorists. Quick, blame the victim for retaliating.

94

ringtail_catz 16 hr ago +50

Territorial ambitions in Lebanon? Israel has retreated from Souther Lebanon every time there has been a diplomatic resolution to the problem of terrorist militias attacking Israel from Lebanese territory. Maybe Macron should urge the Lebanese government to actually do something about the Iranian militia they allow to operate in their country if he’s concerned about additional Israeli incursions into Lebanon.

50

Ultra_Metal 17 hr ago +57

If Israel had territorial ambitions, it wouldn't have returned the entire Sinai to Egypt in exchange for peace. The same applies to Lebanon. Israel will give southern Lebanon back if Hezbollah stops attacking Israel from that land and evacuates its forces from there so they can't prepare any future attacks. Israel doesn't want that land, but it has to be present there to prevent Hezbollah from preparing more attacks. This is the job UNIFIL was supposed to do but they never do anything.

57

DrMikeH49 12 hr ago +10

I’m sure UNIFIL did a few things— like waving to the Hezbollah forces as they passed by with their heavy weapons.

10

dontknow_anything 15 hr ago +37

Why are large parts of West Bank occupied by Israel then?

37

closing-the-thread 15 hr ago +19

>Why are large parts of West Bank occupied by Israel then? To avoid what happened when they (Israel) chose to leave Gaza back in 2005

19

TheLastSamurai101 9 hr ago +5

Ok, why are large parts of the West Bank fully colonised by Israel with permanent settlements and huge numbers of settlers being granted full ownership of Palestinian land from which normal Palestinian people have been expelled? It pretty clearly isn't just a matter of security.

5

dontknow_anything 14 hr ago -1

> To avoid what happened when they (Israel) chose to leave Gaza back in 2005 Ohh, what happened when Israel was forced to stop its illegal occupation of Gaza. That is the same argument colonialist and abusers use.

-1

closing-the-thread 14 hr ago +26

>Ohh, what happened when Israel was forced to stop its illegal occupation of Gaza _[?]_ [ohh, someone doesn’t know their history](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Gaza_cross-border_raid)

26

dontknow_anything 14 hr ago -6

So, since 2005, seven militants hit IDF while retreating, Israel can't give me its illegal occupation of West Bank today and it is completely fine that Israel regularly injures and kills Palestinians trying to access resources in West Bank, part that is their. Got it, 1 Israeli is worth more than 1000s of Palestinians. Can't let the occupiers get hurt.

-6

scrambledhelix 13 hr ago +26

Coming from the team that brought us "the war didn't start on October 7th", you guys sure are allergic to history

26

dev-ai 14 hr ago +17

Because Jordan didn't want the West Bank back, the same say Egypt wanted Sinai back, but not Gaza.

17

dontknow_anything 14 hr ago +28

West Bank is a palestine territory recognized by 157 UN nations.

28

dev-ai 13 hr ago +30

But not by the Palestinian themselves, they have rejected many offers for two state solution that would have had Israel recognizing the West Bank as Palestinian, but Palestinians rejected it because they still claim all land, including Israel as theirs

30

dontknow_anything 13 hr ago +13

Still doesn't make West Bank part of Israel.

13

XSleepwalkerX 13 hr ago -1

Maybe go look at the history of the region before commenting.

-1

dontknow_anything 12 hr ago +5

> Israeli Defence Minister Israel Katz described the strikes as "a pre-emptive attack against Iran to remove threats to the State of Israel". [Source](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-02-28/iran-israel-explosion-tehran/106400716) That is your Defense Minister on 28th February, 2026. Yeah, bring more bots to try to change the narrative as your aggression and occupation makes more people see through your lies.

5

XSleepwalkerX 12 hr ago -1

Like I said, you should probably go pick up a history book, when you say stuff like that it makes you seem like you have zero knowledge of the history of the region.

-1

Kai3137 13 hr ago +5

Everyone knows that’s not gonna happen that’s why Hezbollah needs to be disarmed in the first place

5

earblah 8 hr ago +1

> Israel will give southern Lebanon back if Hezbollah stops attacking Israel Not according to Israeli politicians or the IDF

1

Asleep-Ad1182 17 hr ago +66

You never hear Macron criticising Hezbollah

66

IOnlyFearOFGod 17 hr ago +32

Because Hezbollah isn't an organization that cares what France thinks of them, but for Israel, France has diplomatic ties and relationship. A lot of you people criticizing France for not calling out Hezbollah are brainless, Does anybody here seriously think Hezbollah cares? No! They don't! And if they did care then Lebanon would have become a much better place but these terrorist don't care for anything but themselves. Israel on the other hand is a state with clear and strong ties to Europe, they trade and have deals with each other. Israel ***has*** to listen or at least respond, why waste your breath talking to a stone wall when you can speak to a real person?.

32

ihavestrings 14 hr ago +27

Pretty sure Israel doesn't care about France either. They care more about the rockets Hezbollah launches.

27

gayphilantropist 17 hr ago +39

Or you could do something about it. Instead, they just yap while Frenchmen lose their lives.

39

WarpedNation 11 hr ago +7

That’s the cool part, Israel doesn’t care anymore either. At the beginning they cared what Western Europe thought and tried to act around that and ended up just getting negative pr regardless. Since they started ignoring what they think they have made real tangible gains and accomplished goals.

7

Low_Intention_1327 17 hr ago +2

Its another variation of "what about the hostages?"

2

MedvedTrader 17 hr ago +47

Macron is an idiot. Israel's "ambitions" in Lebanon is not to get rocket fire from it. That's the "ambition".

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Ghaith97 14 hr ago -4

What about Syria? Why are they occupying more and more Syrian territory when not a single rocket was fired from there towards Israel, and when Syria too is hostile towards Hezbollah? Also the Israeli government themselves have explicitly said that their ambition is to expand into that land.

-4

gayphilantropist 18 hr ago +52

Macron, didn't a French peacekeeper just get killed in Southern Lebanon? Can you at least show some teeth, bark a little? You stupid pup.

52

New_Student1645 17 hr ago +23

Diplomacy is not done in public. It’s not what they tell the news, it’s what they say on the private phone calls we’ll never hear about.

23

gayphilantropist 17 hr ago +23

Then why make stupid claims like this and blame Israel, if not for political posturing? If we happily rake U.S politics over hot coals for the stupid things their head of state says, surely we can do the same to France.

23

New_Student1645 14 hr ago +5

Im not denying this is political posturing, im just saying the actual diplomacy happening behind the scenes is nothing like what is said to the press.

5

xmuskorx 14 hr ago +12

Why would Israel listen to Macron who rewarded Hamas for October 7 with recognition?

12

Celtic_Legend 17 hr ago +4

This has as much teeth as any one of us saying it lol. Hardly news

4

Elxcealisx 12 hr ago +2

Israel is a brutal and tyrannical terrorist regime. They need to be boycotted and sanctioned.

2

FavoriteConsequence 16 hr ago

France used to have territorial ambitions in Lebanon, so it can relate, I guess.

0

Macron Urges Israel to Drop ‘Territorial Ambitions’ in Lebanon

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